So I see a bunch of roots style SC's that have no choice but to run water and this is the definitive proof thats its the be all, end all? Cmon...

Also, all those side mounted cars still have air directed to them and while technically on the side, are still very much in the FRONT. Lets not forget Evo's, SRT4s, 335i, what else...

The way you guys are debating this crap is the same way I can argue that with your 'better' cooling, comes more points of failure due to the pump, AMIRIGHT?!?! LOL - lets just call it even and stop the QQ'n.

*posted via mobile*

I wasn't going to get into any discussion, but you seem to be basing your statements on only a small portion of the information. So I feel compiled to (re)point out a couple of things

In an earlier post (copied from my post in the GTM thread) I wrote down some of the benefits for air to water. I wrote them from a neutral standpoint and I didn't see anybody not agreeing with those benefits, not even in the GTM thread.

I'll also repeat what I said in the other thread about reliability
Also the statement was not that is wasn't mounted in the front of the car, but that it wasn't mounted in front of other key components, such as the engine radiator. With the result of having heated air from the intercooler going into the radiator. (I highlighted this same point in my earlier post)

Although the air to water system is pretty tried and proven.
I want to add one personal opinion about the "stick to what is tried and proven".
If everybody thought that way we would still live in the stone ages and would never see any innovations...

Good post, but you seemed to miss my point of 'moving along' more than anything else. I will say this tho...I sure hope they arent just making room on the shelves by using the same core's that the 350's used. Can you say he soaked after one dyno pull, lol.

I know they keep posting about all the real world testing, but i would like to see even a portion of the data they obtained. Something in graph form, showing ambient temp, pre IC temp, and post IC temp, and boost. This would tell EVERYTHING. comparing ambient to pre IC will give you a good idea of how hard they are working the SC, and if its close to its efficiency range, and comparing pre and post IC temps will tell you how well the IC is working. If i missed that somewhere in this thread please point me in the right direction.

if they do that, you're going to buy the kit, right?

LOL. Of course he will.

Why does everyone feel the need to swing from any pair of nuts they can find? These are two great looking kits. And in a few years you can come back and post in either thread, "Ha! Knew our's was better and more reliable . . . ", but until then just stuff the comparisons. You people are absolutely silly.

^ was gonna say so earlier, but I'm staying out of this from now on. At first I thought it was almost insecurity and a search for justification...

GTM can fight their own battle, Stillen can fight their own battle. I feel this forum has become too polarized as a result of this two threads/companies. I hope the damage isn't permanent and once this becomes old news things will go back to normal.

Im sure both kits will do fine, Ill choose the one I like and everyone else will choose the one they like. But in the end it will be all good and hopefully both kits have no major issues so we can enjoy them. Im looking forward to the extra power myself.

its not smart to not do ur due diligence and purchase a kit with out all the information... it is even more questionable to make that statement when at the same time your are implying that you basically bought a kit solely because you are :nutswinger: towards a particular brand... it is a factor to consider, but not the only factor...

stuff the comparisons? ... when purchasing your Z, did you compare it to other cars? ... comparing like items is a common strategy to making an informed decision... since there are no independent information out right now, all somebody could do is to predict how one kit would perform against the other... and at this point you can only do this by analyzing the theories behind each kits' design... air to air vs water to air... vortech vs rotrex... MAF locations... etc etc...

justification/insecurities... since ur initial reaction is this and not to try to share ur opinion about such concerns.. r u admitting that you didn't really consider these topics up when placing your deposit...

Nope. What I'm saying is that it seems some people are trying to point out how much better one kit is than the other over and over and over again even though their mind is set on that kit. If your mind is set, then why keep trying to justify how much better it is than the other kit? Only reason I can think of is that they are searching for justification since they are still unsure about their decision. Its like when an insecure girl tries to find the flaws in all the other girls to feel better about herself.

Both kits will produce similar power, it will come down to drivability and things like that. On that same subject, Sam has been literally swamped with TT builds, I think he had what? 5 different builds going on at once for the past few weeks. I doubt he has spent as much time as he had liked testing the SC. Unless he has mastered the art of being in 10 different places at once. This entire time, Stillen has been conducting testing and driveability and logging thousands of miles on their kit. Just making an observation.

Time will only tell and thats the end of the story. We KNOW both kits work, we have seen results of that. So all the other theoretical arguments you are having right now are a matter of specifics. Specific information we don't have, yet somehow you find a way to arrive at a conclusion that one kit is better or one way of doing things is better.

A lot of the posts are not about analyzing and determining what to purchase. They are an attempt to prove one kit better than the other. And until the kits are out there on the road in good numbers it is silly to do that. I didn't compare my 370 to other cars based on pre production info. I based it on reviews and test drives when the car was out.

But continue as you wish. I'm just trying to point out that there is no reason for the animosity.

1st of, its a forum... a medium to discuss ur opinions and share information... and hopefully as civil as possible..the main goal is to help each other out with what we want to accomplish with our Zs... it doesnt matter if u've set ur preference, what matter is if the information you have presented has some validity...

for example, u'r making a statement that Sam is not having enough time to test the kit... how can you confirm this and how can you assert that he doesnt have techs working for him to help him with the work... perhaps there are 10 sam's at GTM right now... on the other hand, ur using this assumption to imply stillen is doing better testing... are you privvy to how much testing to actually have logged... have you seen any information that has not been presented to everyone else... they do testing and yet they have not provided the statistics to support their tests... so how can you claim that the kit is functioning as designed... i hope you see the fallacies of ur observation ...

it doesnt make sense to me for u to assert insecurities as the reason for the information that was presented... a better analogy would be a dumb pretty girl doing something stupid and saying ur just mad because ur jealous of my prettiness as an excuse for what they did..

all im trying to accomplish is to get more information that will either disprove or confirm the theories that were presented so i can make my decision and help out those who are undecided... information that Stillen actually should already have and for whatever reason has not presented... in fact, the only conclusion i have stated is how it would be illogical for someone to post a deposit at this time with the stillen kit because of the lack of info... :tup:

^ not reading that.

I just don't care what you think, sorry man.

I'm just patiently waiting for my SC, after that we can talk.

Im really interested in the install and how hard or easy it was. And of course the power. Keep us up to date.

Was trying to give you the benefit of the doubt, but after de_dust reading and replying to your post your respond with this?? You want to be heard, but never to listen.

This certainly shows your motivations in all of these threads.