Nissan 370Z Forum - Coolest Oil Catch Can

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PCV WIN TWO of these would be the swanky way to do it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370 (Post 2508921)

PCV WIN TWO of these would be the swanky way to do it.

How this stuff works?

Edit: Nevermind did some google.

http://shopping.netsuite.com/core/me...1c7c1c068ec2f2

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370 (Post 2508920)

Phunk, the pcv valves on the 370z function the same way all pcv valves on all naturally aspirated emissions controlled engines function. They are flow metering check valves. the reason they rattle and the spring inside them is so weak is because they are set up to work with the amount of vacuum the engine produces, so that at idle the valve is open but only flows a little bit of air, because the high vacuum actually lifts the piston inside the valve off the seat and up to the top of the valve where it partially closes the exit orifice of the valve. This allows the system to vent but does not introduce enough air to effect the idle to great extent. when the throttle is opened pressure rises to the point where the piston falls to about the halfway point of the valve allowing much more fumes to be vented since the engine will be able to burn them effectively. when the motor back fires or boost comes on(if F.I.) the valve shut to prevent reversion of fumes into the intake. this is where the catch can does the most work because during boost the valve is shut but often leaks allowing boost to go through the valve, combine this with blow-by past the rings and your going to building a lot of crankcase pressure that can't go anywhere with the factory setup because it is trapped between the intake pipe and the manifold. this leads to popped out dipsticks and reduced power from having a boosted crankcase pressure(not much honestly though). When switching to an external pcv intake filter now the crankcase pressure under boost can escape by going backwards through the system all over your engine bay, which is where the catch can comes in. some systems i've seen have valves or solenoids that under boost will vent the catch can to atmosphere and under vacuum allow the pcv system to function normally the below method will allow you to vent crankcase pressure, without contaminating the intake, or reverting fumes all up under your hood, and for an estimated parts cost of 5-25 dollars.

And my personal favorite pcv system is the exhaust venturii, no oil stain under the hood, no reversion out the filters from blow by on a boosted car, and i can still imagine myself mystically choking up al gore's air every time i drive. Oh and it's by FAR the cheapest if you can weld or have a buddy who can because it involves two small pieces of tube cut on an angle and roughly 4 ft of hose. (also drilled out factory valves), using seperate pcv filters and plugging the intake pipes and the manifold hoses will allow you to eliminate any source of unmetered air caused by the pcv as well

I am very familiar with how the PCV system functions. I do not experience any adverse side effects of excessive crankcase pressure even with FI because of the fresh air inlets that are used as vents when under boost. The vents are 1/2" ID and able to flow outward plenty, combined with the vacuum generated in the intake tubes from my turbos.

I already played with the PCV the other day to make sure I wasn't having any problems from my fresh air inlets pulling unmetered air. By closing the inlets, it blocked enough air to drop RPM about 50rpm until the idle control compensated after a moment, and only a couple tenths at most AF points difference until closed loop feedback compensated... So my unmetered PCV fresh air inlets are negligible as far as effecting my tune.

Otherwise... Stock PCV system (aside from fresh airs bypassing MAF) and tons of power and tons of mileage and no issues at all! Works perfect, just like my 350z has for going on 10 years!

Like I was saying, I don't fault anyone for wanting a catchcan.. But it really doesn't matter. It's not going to make my car any faster or any more reliable.

They shouldn't be unmetered on the stock PCV setup, or any of the intake designs I've seen. None of the connections are in front of the MAFs. Engine vacuum draws from the crankcase, crankcase draws replacement fresh air from the intake tubes, post-MAF.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wstar (Post 2508978)

Correct.. Which was what I was talking about a few posts up.

Turbo 370zs are not like this because all the kits are blowing through the MAF. You could not have your PCV fresh air after the MAF because the MAF is being boosted. You would just be pumping boost straight into the crankcase.

Mo' boost mo' problems :)

I have a conceptual design in my head for a PCV/Catch Can setup that wouldn't have the (albeit limited) drawback of drawing unmetered air etc.

(For forced induction)

I need to get the design on paper, once I do, I'll post it here.

a lot of my previous post wasn't about your car either more of a general discription of pcv's and F.I. and why the stock system needs to be changed for it.

So what your saying is by plugging your pcv your idle changed slightly and your letting the computer correct for the small amount of unmetered air entering the manifold, and your very familiar with how pcv works, but are unsure of why pcv valves are on the 370z since it is not factory boosted(this might be where i am misunderstanding you)?

Also your inlet hoses for the pcv are plumbed to your compressor inlet pipe instead of those little separate filters right? in that case yeah the pcv will work fine other than the negligible amount of unmetered air, and that everything is still going to get dirty(which most people don't care about. If you hooked your pcv up to the seperate little filters instead tho you would get smokey fumes coming from the filters under boost.

Edit: also as a side note i also believe not running a catch can isn't going to cause a problem, they are a waste of money unless you just want everything to stay clean.

All of these non issues and minor annoyances is why i like the exhaust pcv fittings, other than the environment there are no downsides, no dirt, doesn't effect the way the motor runs at all, its cheap (just make sure you use high temp hose)

I have seen the exhaust PCVs used in the past and I agree that they are pretty slick and probably provide superior crankcase vacuum at high engine load where there is none in the manifold.

You are correct about how my PCV is running. My VC to IM are stock, and my VC to air filter tubes are unfortunately before the MAF due to blow-through MAF setup. But ya I played with it and it doesn't seem to be flowing enough unmetered air that my feedback cycles for idle and fuel trim cant handle it.

Usually all I will do (if needed) to a PCV system for a higher power FI car is enlarge the vents if possible, or add another if needed. My only real argument about why I dont use a catch can "just because" is only about space, organization, clean engine bay, etc. I prefer to eliminate anything in the engine bay that is not needed as, especially with twin turbos, space comes at a premium.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1slow370 (Post 2508921)

PCV WIN TWO of these would be the swanky way to do it.

Illegal for the track but to each their own.

Phunk outside the engine bay has room.

Quote:

Originally Posted by synolimit (Post 2510438)

Illegal for the track but to each their own.

Phunk outside the engine bay has room.

How is this not legal for 'the track'? Also, please clarify what 'the track' is.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sh0velMan (Post 2510462)

How is this not legal for 'the track'? Also, please clarify what 'the track' is.

You just provided a direct line for oil to come out of the motor and onto the track. All systems must run through the motor first so it has a chance to be 1. Burnt up in combustion and 2. Can stay in the motors cylinders if a catastrophic failure should occur; like a stock PCV system. When the motor goes you will flood the track with oil and if I wreck because you have an illegal setup and tech missed it I'd kill them! There are no vent to atmos or re routed crank and valve systems aloud. A AOS is aloud on a race track because it will catch oil and it's basically plumbed just the OEM back to the manifold. A catch can is not aloud except on a drag strip because you can't exhaust much blow by in <20 seconds vs 20min on a race course unless the can again is plumbed back to the manifold.

Quote:

Originally Posted by synolimit (Post 2510438)

Illegal for the track but to each their own.

Phunk outside the engine bay has room.

All my extra cowl space is where my vacuum manifold, boost controller, all vacuum plumbing is tucked! I am tight on space just about everywhere right now.

I actually like the look of this one. Do you think this would be overkill if I got two of them for a n/a car?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Werty (Post 2489162)

coolest catch can? here you go!

Ultimate Oil Catch Can 1/2" NPT

They also have a more stealth looking version

http://www.42draftdesigns.com/images...s/cc_ult01.jpg

http://www.42draftdesigns.com/images...s/cc_ult09.jpg

http://www.42draftdesigns.com/images...s/cc_ult13.jpg

http://www.42draftdesigns.com/images...s/cc_ult10.jpg

Hmm never heard of slash cuts being illegal at most tracks, i mean if you have a blow up chances are oil is coming out of your car from many places including LOTS of it coming out your exhaust. I have had my windshield sprayed a couple times already from cars that were just in crap condition and they pass tech. I KNOW they are legal at just about every dragstrip and i say "just about every" because there may be a backwater strip somewhere that's banned them. and most scca and nasa classes don't let you touch the pcv at all except for the addition of a catch can, but you have to use factory hose routing and no external filters.

edit: i actually spent a couple hours reading through different class regulations here and there and it is either no restriction or oem only for the most part so it all depends on your class and tech. also unless you have a SEVERE problem, there isn't going to be any real oil coming out because hot oil and air mixture + header collector or downpipe temperatures = burning oil fumesresulting in some carbon put no oil per say

True oil will come out but again coming out just the exhaust vs coming out the motor then the exhaust is the difference. And I've never seen track or drag strip rules, its in the race organizations rules.

you mean like track day club rules? I know most hpde days don't tech anything past safety belts, helmet, tires, and brakes. If you are talking organized racing classes most class rules are either it needs to be stock or no restriction. There are no restrictions on pcv in any TT class for example.

Can we have a simple up/down for the benefits if any for N/A 370Zs?

Quote:

Originally Posted by takjak2 (Post 2511914)

Can we have a simple up/down for the benefits if any for N/A 370Zs?

Pros- cleaner intake tract. Cons- cost, under hood clutter. Is it necessary? No.

So what we can do here for TT setup?

Im interested in purchasing oil catch can with redesigned PCV for TT application if some1 came up with.

G37sHKS,
I actually was PMing Sh0vel about this a few days ago since I am looking to run one in my GTM TT when I get it all installed. This is what he said in his reply;

So, for an FI setup, you would want to plumb it a little differently. Basically, put a breather filter on the fat connection (back of the cover) and put the front connection into the catch can with the can outlet dumped into another breather filter.
Then cap/plug the manifold nipple (sticks out the front of the manifold).
This is the only way I see to do it that will relieve pressure build up from blow-by and still catch the oil. Crankcase scavenging at non-boost times will be a little poor, but most agree it's not a big deal. This is the really simple way of doing it.

Now the more complicated way;
For my own car, I would probably set up a pair of check valves on the cans.
Basically one between the manifold and the can that only allows air to pass IN TO the manifold, not out of. Another between the can and it's breather that allows air OUT but not IN. Then I'd plumb the fat connection (back of the cover) to the inlet pipe after the MAF (if a connection is available there).This way, you maintain the excellent scavenging off boost but won't have issues while on boost.

I replied and am patiently waiting for him to finish a diagram / parts list he's working on, he mentioned it earlier in this thread.

<slightly off topic> I ordered my Saikou Michi catch cans today :happydance: </off topic>

Are catch cans a worthwhile thing to have to keep carbon deposits down in the engine, FI and NA?

Probably not, but I'm getting some anyway as I am setting my car up for some track days. :driving: