I mean, at some point it is semantics. The overall feel of the car screams GT to me. Maybe I'm a purist. The Ariel guys called my s a borderline GT car, so it's all relative.

Only on hellbender coming in. The dragon doesn't take much braking if you drive it well though.

I took everyones temps. I logged pretty much everything because I like to see how the cars perform. Diff and rotors were the most enlightening.

Well that is the issue, what once was a sports car might not be one, it is still a 2 seater FR platform, manual transmissions, etc. but is it still a 'sports car.'
Honestly the definition of a lot of cars has been blurred, from sports car to hypercar.

To me, it is too heavy, too big, and the biggest thing is the engine location. If it's not at least Front midship-ish, I view the car as GT.

I will ask this question and this is not at all to down anyone... but how many here actually have driven or own a 12 second car? The fastest 1/4 time we have NA on here is 12.24 I believe and that is with all bolt ons and 4.08 gears ... as far as I know anyway.

Let me say this... 12.24 is a GOOD time.. and it is a FAST car. Think about it. People talk about these new mustangs and such and yes they are very impressive cars with great times. They run a 12.2 or so correct? Think about how much HP it needs to get to that point because of weight. I was just out running some errands and with just my ART pipes i'm VERY happy with my car... it's a real joy to drive IMO.

Anyway, a lot of people will claim to have been in this car or that one, but ultimately some are lying and again... where is the cut off? The car as of now NA won't make 400 whp... so the hell what? If it would make 400, you'd want 425, and then 450 and so on... it's the way we are as men lol.

I've never actually owned a 12 second car.

I have owned a couple of cars that make 12 second cars look laughably slow. I've broken into the 9s on two different platforms.

I owned a 12 sec speed6 and owned a 04 kaw 636 ( 10 sec bike ) so for me no car really feels fast unless your like red and have owned cars that go 9s Haha

As methodical said though , overall drivability I have a blast with this car ! To kno it can go 12s bolted is enough for me .. for now ! Muhah

Well, I congratulate you on that, but for most of us who don't live our lives a quarter of a mile at a time, low 12's should be fine.

We're talking cars... not bikes, and I guess this issue is getting off topic. Yes, I am happy with the engine... I think for an NA V6 and being the fastest stock Z in it's history, it's a nice set-up... if others aren't happy with theirs... they should sell it... pretty simple IMHO.

It's not about et's, I agree. Just posted in response to your challenge.

Most of us don't even need 12 second cars. For pure driving pleasure, it's about balance rather than power...

I have no beef with the z power levels, i am frustrated by the fact that it doesnt know what it is. A smoother engine in a car with better balance would be perfect, or an engine with more potential in the current layout would be cool too. As it is, balance is off for track, and you can't crank enough power out to make it a burner. It does look effing sexy tho

Ok, well i'll agree there. I feel like the car is pretty balanced myself... granted I haven't had it on a track so I can't say completely. Another engine option would have always been a nice choice... but I think it just all came down to cost, you have to cut some here and there so you can add in other areas.

I think of my Evo's... I loved them! They were so much fun, they would take a beating and just kept on going... but for a 30k+ car to have an interior SOOO incredibly cheap was just amazing to me... when you buy an Evo you are paying for the drivetrain suspension and brakes... you sure aren't paying for comfort. Then I look at the GTI that has a top notch interior... though I don't get the plaid seats? Maybe some really like it. Either way though it's an excellent all around car.

The Z is a step above that... stock for stock it will hang with a new Evo or STI. No, it doesn't have the modding ability, but here again... I got the Z purposely because the only way to get huge power was to go F.I. in which you're talking at least 5k... which I knew I wouldn't spend because i'm getting married and I need the money. I can afford smaller mods here and there and once all of the NA bolt on's are on... that will be enough for me and they are all easy to take off, put back to stock and sell, though I don't plan on getting rid of this car for a lonnnng time.

Well I think your going to be closer to 1k without a radiator pads are over 100 buck so is fluid , Where I live in the summer its above 85 closer to 90 f hence the radiator and I want to track at least once a month in the summer . Brakes are also a must they at least need to be vented .my point about the 240 was that is was cheap and takes mods better than the 370z Thats it . I love the car really I just wish it wasn't driving in town watching my oil temp rise to 240f on a regular basis .

Coming from AWD, it makes sense that the z feels balanced. Give it time.


It's a mistake to say the z hangs with stock sti's and Evo's though...there's a reason the z got dropped to c stock.

Who told you a radiator is needed?
We have guys running in Texas the past few weeks with stock radiator in 105+ temps with no problem. Look around you can get your fluid & pads for around 100 bucks, 150-200 if you just buy the first link that pops up.

The 240 was cheap because it was a cheap car from factory. Also, are you talking about the KA motor? It is decent at best, one of the main reasons engine swaps from day 1 were so common with that car.

Agreed. Coolant temps are pretty well controlled unless you seriously block airflow.

I prefer putting a metal plate over it then tracking, I like to challenge myself and ruin the car. :rolleyes:

A lot of the people that install bigger oil coolers have created airflow issues.

What do you mean its a mistake? The 370 would be right next to both of those cars if not beat them stock for stock.

Right, that's why they moved the z to c stock:rolleyes:

What is "c stock"

yeah... i'm not picking up on that one either :confused:

C stock is the level the 370z competes in out of the box.
It is a lower class compared to some other cars it 'should' compete against, basically it is an insult sort of.

It was b stock, but it wasn't competitive. It barely competes in c stock. Nismo is still bs, but has some favorable things allowed (tirewise), still can't catch Evo's.

Oh I know why it was downgraded, but it is a slap in the face that it had to be moved down because it could not compete out of the box.

Id still rather have a badass looking C class car, than a hideous 4 door grocery getting B class.

:P

Roger. Clarification less intended at you and more to the guys who don't know what the classing means.

Just putting it out there and I'm a total noob when it comes to SCCA classification, but doesn't the driver play a big role. I would think the AWD cars are a bit easier to drive than the Z. I've seen RX-8's run in B-stock for example, which I know personally "feels" far easier to drive in the twisties that the 370z.

At the level they are classing them it is not really an issue. The class is usually done based on the performance with the competitive drivers behind the wheels. Guys like grant (shamu) helped keep the nismo classed in B due to a good showing. If it was about noob driving, the s wouldn't run b stock.

why did you even buy one? lol

Is it it safe to assume that there is that much of a difference between a stock Nismo and non-Nismo then... or could guys like Grant push a non-Nismo up to B. How much of a difference are we takling about?

Not trying to start an argument or anything, just curious.

Like I said, there were some things that worked out favorably for the nismo as well in terms of the tires they were able to run, etc. His niz had a lot more $$ in it than many Evo's as well.

Hard to say for sure. My guess would be he could probably get close to the nismo level, but he was still a bit off from the Evo's. I don't think it can really be competitive there right now.

Regarding the whole braking issue: Car and Driver didn't crash because the car they had was abused. If that was the case, half of the cars they track would've been crashed too. Nissan issued a statement saying that the Akebonos come equipped with a standard street brake pad that does an adequate job of stopping the car with minimal amounts of brake dust - purely a consumer influenced decision. Stopping distances of 100 ft were recorded by numerous publishers, and that's actually superb - Porsche levels right there. Nissan added that if buyers wanted a high-temp fade-resistant pad they could spend $600 on the optional Nismo pads. Then people on the iterwabz were like "why didn't they just include that pad stock?" Because, they dust like all sorts of hell.

I have them on my car (they came with it, I didn't order them). When you need to: they'll stop the car like you're hitting a brick wall. But my God, my wheels turn black after 20 miles of driving or one firm stop! I can't imagine owners liking that very much, at all. My 350Z kept its wheels clean for as long as a week on the OEM pads.

Cuz this info wasn't around when I was shopping.

Besides, I didn't buy the car to compete. My Subaru does a far better job on most courses...the z is just for fun.

so you are selling it now and going to buy....? Something else?

Yes. Probably several somethings.

[QUOTE=pyrrhus17;1288390]"The is suppose to be a poor mans sports car. A loaded Auto convert runs close to 50K thats not cheap, so could you imagine if they offered a TT or SC version. Anyone who bought this car thinking they where going to be a stop light champ was sadly mistaken and did not do there reasearch before buying. If you wanted to be the fastest guy around in a straight line you shoudl have bought a Vette or the 5.0"

Thats my point the car is not cheap nor is it a sports car , cheap like a 240sx I can go with or 50k and I can go around the track more than twice .I dont care about drag speed. I care about handling and speed and the TT 300z weren't that expensive back in the day (research done ) .the fact that you have to spend 2k to get your car in track shape is ******** ,again (oilcooler , brake venting , radiator, ) .I love the car really , but NISSAN could have at least vented the brakes and given us a oilcooler WTF

RED ZED is a perfect example of the type of Z owner I am talking about ,Nissan is missing something here .Him and evryone like HIM . I am not into driving a moder fricking MG or Triumph Tr6 call myself a sports car and be slower than a toyota corolla . Reasearch done ! This car should be contender and it doesn't feel like it is . P.S. No one tracks there cars because A. it overheats ,Not fun . B they buy a 944 to track which is more fun.[/QUOTE]


/\:icon14: our car has already seen track days and will see many many more. Z just needs and oil cooler and brake pads/fluid to track. As you get more serious, you can add in some more things, but this is all the same stuff you'll be adding to just about any car as you start tracking it, (esp for any car in the Z's price range).

Oh, and for an n/a Z, radiator upgrade isn't necessary.

^^ very much agree. Of course an older car would be less expensive to track than a newer car. Less than $1k to get it track ready is pretty "affordable" for people who would track a 370. Besides, you should only track what you can afford to crash. The Z may no longer be the fastest in this range, but it's far from slow. There's more to it than it's ability to be track worthy. Have seen what some Mazeratti's run in the quarter, flawed, but it hardly means in any less of a sports car.

I've read a few articles... the Z is comparable and even beats the BMW 135i stock for stock in many areas... it also ran pretty comparable numbers to the Cayman S, though it doesn't have as much power as the Z it's 250 lbs lighter.

My beef here is the (potential) warranty issues created by the oil cooler.

You can go with the Nismo cooler and dealership install it.