What is needed to setup my suspension
 

Hi guys,

I am a total noob when it comes to the suspension game, but I want to have my car set up properly with all the right parts after I install coilovers. My goal is to run slightly lowered with an aggressive track setup that can go up to -3.0 camber in the front and up to -2.5 in the rear.

I understand that I will need upper control arms for the front for what I am looking to do but I am completely lost for what I need in the rear. From what I was told, I will be needing rear toe links, rear toe bolt and possible rear camber arms.

Is there something that is missing or unnecessary? I just don't want to be missing anything before I go get my alignment and corner balanced.

PM [OptionZero] or read his thread,,,He know's how to set-up the aggressive stance!

You will need toe bolts, camber eccentric lockouts, and Camber arms for the rear. Toe links are only used if you go to true coilovers for the rear.

Are these "true coilovers"? Sorry I am a total noob :(

GReddy

Is this going to be a track car only? Or are you planning on running on the street too?

Go to SPL websites and everything they have from bushings to camber arms and a arms. Check out Rusty's build thread a copy everything. Also I would not go more than -2.0 in the rear. Don't no how much track experience you have but -1.7 to -2.0 rear and -2.3 to -2.6 will be good to go for the most part. If dedicated track car then around -3.0 plus or minus depending on the track. Lots of variables depending on the track and if you want to complete in time attacks or some other competitive events.

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I want it to be track ready, but it will be running on the street as well.

Will do. Thank you for your input. :tiphat:

What tires you planning on running? What sizes, rim specs too? Everything has to mate up.

I have a new set of S04 Pole Positions that were just mounted two days ago. They are 245/40/19 front and 285/35/19 rear. Wheels are stock 19 inch rays from sport package.

No problem...tracking is expensive! If you are going to run the the same set of tires and rims on the street as you do on the the track you are going to burn through a bunch of tires. If your camber is going to be in the -3.0 range you are going to get some uneven wear. Get yourself a square setup on another set of rims, you can get a set of enkie's for around $1400 new and that way you can have a dedicated set of track tires. Also, except to spend between $3k to $7k if you want do it right. Remember your drive train is a big component in optimizing your suspension.

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Have you ever done a trackday before?

Read this thread.

http://www.the370z.com/track-autocro...must-read.html

Your alignment settings are too far. Front camber should be -2.0. Rear camber -1.5 to -1.7 for you.

You will get a lot of understeer with your front tire size. Not big enough.

What Rust said "Everything has to mate up!" I would say buy a Hotchkis front sway bar, get some better brake pads (yellow stuff), stainless steel brake lines and good brake fluid and head to the track and upgrade as you can. Also, if you have not done it get a 34 row oil cooler! Lost of stuff to run with the bulls!

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Those rear's will fit on the front...you could get another pair & use w/spacer's out back or bigger wheel's all over.

Perfect recommendation old tall wise one! :p

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Sounds good. As for the Enkei's are you referring to the rpf1's?

For now I'm just putting my foot in the water and I guess I don't need that extreme camber settings. Down the line I will look into more if I become a dedicated track junkie, but now I am just looking at maybe 2-3 sessions per year. I just want to be able to have the adjustability settings available so the car can run properly with coilovers.

So far I have a cusco front sway bar. Pads, lines, and fluids will be coming soon. Oil cooler has been sitting in my garage for almost a year :'(

Thank you for all your input. I learned a lot in the past hour lol. I should have turned to this forum to learn sooner. I've been asking my friends who are mostly Subaru guys and they have been telling me different things.

:tup: I'm still good. At least I don't have to put a broom stick up my a$$ to push it out to take a leak yet. :eek:

I'm no wear near an expert like my buddy Rusty and a bunch of others on here. Read the thread Rusty linked you as it has a bunch of great stuff. This was my first year tracking and I learned a ton by doing and tearing $hit up. It is a rush and I can't get enough right now. Good luck and keep asking questions!

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Subi's need a different set-up because they are all wheel drive. What works on them, for the most part will not work on the Z. But the basic's are the same.

I've been tracking my Nismo for about 5 years now. This rabbit hole that you are about to go down into get $$$$ the deeper you get. But it's fun as helll! :driving:

Yeah & Don't forget you got more than 2x the factory RWHP/TQ than a stock Z!

I might lose him on the straight. But I'll still pass him on the brakes.:eek: :rofl2:

he's braking stuff while running all out in the marbles... :)

I do have a set of coilovers on the way (greddy x kw) so I still want to make sure I can get the allignment setup properly at the very least. On one the threads that was linked it said I will also need lower control arms for the front. Would it really be necessary for now? Or will I be able to survive with front and rear control arms + lockout eccentric?

This is exciting and expensive so I wanna just go in to explore this new realm without having my bank account punch me in the face overnight

You'll need upper control arms, not lower for the front. Depending on how low you go with the new coil-overs. As to what is needed for the rear. You might need only toe bolts. But going farther. Camber arms.

Have you tried a set of extremes on this car, or any car yet? Before you install any suspension piece, its best you explore the limits of grip in factory settings first.

There are several benefits to doing this even with the standard size tires, before going crazy with alignment changes and larger wheel/tire sizes.

For one. Most of the extremes have larger tread blocks, which not only establish a higher level of contact patch for the same size, but wear in a much more uniform fashion. With this you can clearly gauge how much and where the tires are wearing most. There is no point of adding additional camber if you can't accurately use all of the available rubber on standard sizes.

In motorcycle terms, you've probably heard this banter called "chicken strips" on the tires. Similar lack of wear lines can be established on normal car tires. gauging these wear lines give you an idea of how the camber is effecting tire contact patch and also how much steering input you are putting in and where in relations to corner loads and throttle modulation.

Another form of measurement you'd should start implementing immediately if you don't already, is measuring tire pressures and heat margins across the tires. A cheap harbor freight of homedepot infrared gun can gauge heat across the tire accurate enough to tell you how much heat you are balancing across the tread. In these summer conditions you may find it easy to go from a cold 35psi to hot 41 psi in a relatively short spirited run, but getting temps up in colder conditions is equally important.

For the sake of understanding what you are feeling, its good to also randomly test different tire pressures so you know what overinflated tires feel like compared to under inflated. The gas station air pump should be your new best friend.

You have several back roads i'm sure you take advantage of already. But instead of trying to go outright fast or pushing the limits. Push the limits in different ways. Form a solid pace and intentionally try to induce understeer and oversteer by playing around with your steering input speeds as well how early or how late you enter a corner with modulation of braking a acceleration. Measure the tires accordingly after each run. You may say this is stupid or unsafe, but this is the point of establishing a slower overall speed.

Practice makes perfect, build up the aggression gradually :tiphat:

I started with a stock Z for the most part, and changed things as I got more experienced. Nothing beats face time behind the windshield. :driving:

You are probably right there getting better all the time but with so much power coming into a turn braking is tricky to early most of the time and yes the instructors or group four go fast go fast guys eat my lunch in the corners. I will get there...

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Very well said, good sir. Reason why I am looking to increase negative camber is because I've noticed that the outer edges of all 4 of my tires have been wearing out considerably faster than the rest of the tire.

We got 5 groups. Group 1 Newbies with instructor. Group 2 with instructor. Group 2 Solo. Group 3 crazies. Group 3 open wheel. I'm in the Group 3 crazies with their race cars. :eek: :driving: Nothing like getting passed by a Nascrap Stocker, or a Ford GT 40. :yum:

The Z has a steep camber curve in the rear. If you are wearing the outside edge. You are wearing the inside edge too. Measure your tread depth across the tires and write it down. Do you know what your alignment is at now?

That's too late now as I already put on a new set :wtf2:

But my outer edge was almost bald compared to the inner edge after 16k on the stock RE050A. Alignment should be oem spec unless something is not right. Haven't gotten the alignment checked but will do after I install coils and whatever else need be near the end of the month.

Keep a notebook. Write down everything you do. Date, mileage, alignment settings, oil changes, mods, tire measurements, parts replaced, etc.

Were you measuring tire pressure consistently?. Given the natural weight balance of the car, its possible the rears are just moderately scrubbing during turns. This is not unusual with front weight biased vehicles.

As a cheat/penalty, carry an extra 40-70ibs in the rear. Of course strap whatever it is down as best as possible. as far rearward as possible as well.

You don't have to burden yourself with this practice indefinitely, but just enough times to gauge how the tires react to a slightly rearward bias change. The GVWR accounts for a load range of up to about 200ibs. Additional loads on the rear can keep the tires from sliding and scrubbing the surface. Downforce :tiphat:

Something interesting to experiment with. :tup:

But I do check my tire pressure every week.

WOW, this thread changed direction quick. If you want a startup track setup your best beat is to buy the SPL front FUCA, SPL rear camber arms, SPL rear lockout kit, and invest in a upgraded LSD. This way you can adjust your alignment and get ride of the crappy factory diff. This and seat time will improve your lap times with least amount of money spent.

No point of beating a dead horse, control arms were already suggested, an LSD is an age old recommendation as of now, it's a matter of cost and total usage. Several people have gotten away with using the factory differential at the track including myself with several cars. Of course there is a limitation, but adding a new one comes with increased complexities in both drive-ability and wear. In most cases using the standard setup up first at the track with different tires gives one a better base line for expectations and measurements against mechanical and geometrical changes.

I don't know what your problem is but you can stow it as far as I am concerned. Stop following me around and attacking what I have to say.

Go back to the G37 forum where you belong.