Fun Track Day, Little Mishap
 

Yesterday I did a mini-PDX with SCCA at Autobahn Country Club South Course. We ran from 530-830pm and got 3 run sessions in for $115. All things considered, it's a great deal. I usually lose interest after the 3rd session, so this was a perfect setup.

When I arrived, I discovered they put me in the Advanced group. After inquiring, they said it's because I've done 5 track days. I laughed at first, but then I asked two coordinators to move me down a group. Neither would listen and move me down a group. Needless to say I was a little pissed and nervous. The PDXs I've done before usually have instructors running their own cars in the advanced group...no place for me to be.

Well, today was no different. I could only hold my own with 2 other cars out of the 10 or so in the group. At one point, a guy was riding my a$$ all the way around to the passing zone and pressuring me. Here's a video of how that turned out! Fortunately, he didn't drive right through my driver's side door. Why an instructor would pressure a driver of clearly lower skill level is beyond me.

A word of advice to anyone doing track days. INSIST that you be placed in a group of your confidence and skill level. To any event coordinators, if someone wants to move DOWN a group LET THEM!!! This is just common sense that the coordinators were lacking yesterday.

Wow that was a nice high speed blip there. Good job at keeping it under control. Very nice save!

I agree with you about the instructor thing. I think Bobo had his issue at VIR after his instructor prematurely let him push it.

I spun my Mustang at VIR years ago in a slower section of the course. It's funny how you don't even think about your safety. It's like, "oh crap, I'm about to wreck my street car!"

out of curiosity, what should you have done? gassed it hard and turned the wheel right?

nice recovery!

Nicer tires would have helped, I think he either lifted or jerked the wheel too hard to the left.

It's an off-camber left and I cut in too hard, too fast. The back just got light and started to come around. Also, it was 97F outside and the stock Bridgestones were pretty gummy...still entirely driver fault though. I wonder if being even quicker with full right lock would have had a complete recovery on track.

M4, you're right. I had a jerkoff in a 350Z tight on my rear and during the incident I kept worrying he would T-bone me. Moments like that feel soooo much longer when they are happening though. When I watched the video the first time, it seemed very quick. I felt like I was sideways for about 5 minutes when it happened.

I am surprised you ran with all of the storms that went through yesterday, congrats on the save



DAN

Thanks. We stayed dry until the end of the last session around 815pm. Then the big storms came through.

On a side note, the 25 row Setrab oil cooler was a star. Max temp was 240 and in one lap it'll cool down to 220F. My friend in his 40th anniv without a cooler was pegging at 280 after a few laps each session. The cooler addition was worth its weight in gold.

I definitely had full right lock. The problem is that I lost traction in the rear. Mashing the accelerator would have worsened the situation. What I ended up doing was full right lock and clutch in...no brake or gas. As I slowed while sideways, I gently applied some brake and the car came back facing forward as I steered off and parallel to the track. I think being even faster with the right lock could have kept it on the track completely.

Was a good save. Sucks when you get pressured like that from behind.

They definitely should have let you drop down to intermediate at your request, that's just silly, 5 track days doesn't make you an expert. It was nice that it came back to you gracefully, the brakes on this car are good at straightening you out if you are getting sideways.

I don't know if it is possible, but I highly recommend mounting the camera behind the driver so you can see the hands better. You might not see as much track (or as clear), but it really helps in correcting mistakes or spotting them.

Definitely nice recovery! Were you running alignment (camber and toe) within factory spec? You mentioned in the video about it "letting go progressively".

Yeah. Aside from Hotchkis sways, the suspension is bone stock with no further adjustment. When it let go, the rear came around slowly at first and then picked up speed. Definitely knew what was coming!

Definitely a good idea. I have to find a better way to mount the GoPro when I have a passenger. When there is no one in the passenger seat, I like to remove the headrest and put the suction cup on the little side window (see pic). It gives a perfect view of the track and full interior. With passenger...I haven't found a great spot yet.

You could try mounting it to the inside of the rear glass or on the rear brace.

Inside rear window works well.

I thought I tried the rear window but felt it was too far back. I'll try it again. The rear brace is pretty low and gives a center stack view...again just using the GoPro mounts in the kit.

I'd like to find a headrest mount that attaches to the two supports.

You'd definitely need to custom fab a mount for the rear brace.

Honestly, all you really need is a block of wood or something and some velcro to secure it to the top of the brace, then mount the go-pro to the block.

For a finished effect you could paint the block, wrap it with vinyl, or finish it with a nice stain. :D

Someone here did a camera rig setup that attaches to the back of the headrest. Look in the DIY section.

That's not completely true. Getting back on the throttle in a controlled manner would have shifted more weight onto the rear helping it find traction. Combine that with more opposite lock as soon as you start to feel the rear come around and you could have probably saved it completely. Still well done not putting it into the wall.

As far as I'm concerned that is a complete save. He didn't hit a thing.

Love those houses on the side of the track.

Your car sounds so good. Quick, too. Glad you made it through w/o any damage.

That isn't bad at all, the rear view mirror gets in the way of my ghetto setup with a flip camera

Universal Car Windshield Vent CellPhone Holder Mount - eBay (item 270612511165 end time Aug-23-10 17:44:30 PDT)

YouTube - Marc autoxing 370z

Nice one.

I'm a decent driver, but definitely can have room for improving. It's that kind of thing that makes me want to do some drift days, so when I go to the track and that happens it's not such a scary experience. Could even be fun if you get good right ;)

Glad you didn't damage the car.

wow.. good save. You're so lucky the cars behind you didn't hit you as they were right behind you! :eek:

Did you use GoPro in your first video? where did you mount it? :pics:

It doesn't do $hit, learn how to drive properly and it would never happen.

ya, drift guys can't drive and have no car control skill :rolleyes:

Most can't make it as a race car driver because they are too slow. It's like the Harlem Globetrotters.

1. While I understand your point it has nothing to do with my point. The skills learned drifting are good for accident avoidance and when the unexpected happens for the average guy. That's why they teach it a the BMW schools ect. ect.

2. There are examples of the the other side of the coin. There are drifters that have competed at Super GT, Lemans ect. levels:

http://dascorsa1.do.sapo.pt/DoriDori/DSC_7549.jpg
http://img.youtube.com/vi/H3Ax20yNYww/0.jpg
http://www.qing69.com/upload/69image...2957320-23.jpg
http://www.racerevo.com/wp-content/u...010/07/043.jpg

Lets not derail this thread...

I'm Done lol.

They never won LeMans, only the Mazda did as a Japanese manufacture. They will also be the first one to tell you they only do it for fun, not because it is fast. Plus if you know how to drive, how to control a sliding car should come natural.

Sam Hubinette. I rest my case.

There is certainly value in skid control training. I'll be honest...I was googling around to find some courses in my area after this experience. I know Autobahn CC has a skid car too. That's exactly what I'd like some more time with. It takes muscle memory and training to stay on the throttle rather than lift, react appropriately and quickly, etc etc. AutoX is helpful but just not the same. Going sideways at 70mph is very differnt than 30mph. Skid training certainly can't hurt, unless it builds undeserved confidence.

So, anyone know of a decent school that teaches skid control? All I've seen that offer it are these teen driving programs. I'd be the weird 30 year old with all the teens in the class.

Once you have more experience, stuff like that should come natural to you. YouTube - 350Z Shenandoah Corner too hot and too deep pass

YouTube - 350Z Shenandoah Wet Chasing BMW I had full slicks in pouring rain, never went completely sideways and I was keeping up with the slipping and sliding BMW

Nice vids and driving. I suppose I'd rather garner my experience in a more controlled situation than my original video! Although I guess I'll learn pretty quickly from those types of experiences.

in off-camber turns, i think it is really important to not be early, because if you lose traction on entry, you're not going to find it during the turn. it does look like you're a little early in that turn, no doubt because of being pressured.

others will have better advice than me, but i wouldn't do clutch and/or brake in unless you have completely given up on the turn and are off course. in this case, your best bet is ultra-quick right lock, and easing off the gas: not a mash (power oversteer- car rotates like a top), not a lift (weight totally off the rear, and you go around 911-style). if you catch it, return wheel to neutral (quickly) and ease into the throttle.

by putting the clutch in, you 1: have eliminated the possibility of the throttle helping you steer the car, 2: could re-upset the car when re-engaging.

that being said, i think you did better than i would have in this circumstance, and better than 95% of drivers out there! i do one thing better: if i have someone riding my *** obnoxiously, i give them a wave so they know i've seen them, and then forget about them until the next passing zone: they can't pass you in the meantime, so they can just **** off until the straightaway!

That turn is tricky, as was the previous one. Was traction control off or on? Once you commit, you have to follow through. It's hard to tell, but was there any attempt at correction prior to the full spin?

Either way, you got off easy with the lazy spin to driver's left and into grass. Good work. :)

VDC was off. If it was on, I'm sure the slide would have been tamed very quickly and never would have become a perpendicular experience.

As things started to break loose prior to the apex, I slowly added right lock. However, what felt like a little tail wag quickly escalated and I then put on the right lock as fast as I could. Probably more right lock early would have saved it but I just didn't feel it was going to 'go' that fast (prior to full slide).


On a side note, I really appreciate all the comments and insight. This post-track analysis is equally or more valuable than the actual slide experience!