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-   -   Who's making the move to STU? (http://www.the370z.com/track-autocross-drifting-dragstrip/126272-whos-making-move-stu.html)

Zewerr 03-03-2020 01:34 AM

Might be a good idea not replacing the diff cover. Though, it seems that every one of us that does have the ABS problem have the Z1 cover. So, maybe the others don't have the issue? I'm really not sure.

ConekillerZ34 03-03-2020 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zewerr (Post 3912411)
Might be a good idea not replacing the diff cover. Though, it seems that every one of us that does have the ABS problem have the Z1 cover. So, maybe the others don't have the issue? I'm really not sure.

That may be the case, as it should only depend on whether or not the covers displace the sensors. This feels bad in general since it seems like Nissan could have just avoided putting the sensors there.

That said, since I have a Nismo, I already have a finned cover so I'm just going to pass on the extra capacity. No reason the OSG needs a different cover for fitment, right? I had one in my 350 without a different cover so I assume it doesn't matter.

Rusty 03-03-2020 10:34 AM

Take this for what it is. I have the OS Giken diff, the Z1 diff cover, MAM diff cooler, and Diff temp gauge. My diff lube capacity almost 3 liters. I do trackdays. You auto-x guys don't spend that much time on the course as the track guys. My observations with the diff temp gauge. It takes about 12 miles on the road to start heating up the diff lube. It will read between 120F to 140F. I can drive on the highway at 80 mph for 4 hrs non stop and the diff temp will be between 250F to 265F. 20 minutes on the track will send the temp over 275F. All of this is with my diff cooler turned off. With the diff cooler on. My diff temps stay under 220F.

My point being about the extra capacity of the Z1 cover. I think you would be fins without it. Now if you do trackdays too. I would get it.

Brendan 03-07-2020 10:26 PM

Got the seat this week and installed it today. I went with the Recaro RS-GK which is their JDM market seat. I'm slim and tall (6'2" 160lbs) but most of my height is my legs so I fit perfectly in the waist and shoulders. I mounted the seat on a sliding mount from PCI since I wanted the option of having co drivers of differing heights. With the seat adjusted for optimal leg and hand position, I have more headroom than with the stock seats.

https://i.imgur.com/EuUsvqF.jpg?1

https://i.imgur.com/d9Tv517.jpg?1

Initial impressions are positive. I will have to wait for a few weeks before I can try them out at an event but next to the diff, this is looking to be the most influential mod on car.

Regarding my spl arm idea, that will have to wait. Maybe another arm option will spring up in the mean time as more demand for easier to use arms grows with more people building these cars.

Brendan 03-08-2020 10:33 PM

Glamour shots as the car currently sits. Right now it's probably my favorite iteration of my car so far. All I have left to do before this season starts is change the oil and diff fluid and I'm thinking about installing another pair of helper springs in the front to get some more down travel. Cant wait to race this thing...


https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...0b4dc37a_c.jpg_BES6722 by brendan sobers, on Flick

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...8e3ecd80_c.jpg_BES6753 by brendan sobers, on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...ac14b49a_c.jpg_BES6748 by brendan sobers, on Flickr

https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/...79c8a333_c.jpg_BES6735 by brendan sobers, on Flickr

ConekillerZ34 03-23-2020 11:54 PM

2pc Rotors installed last week, OS Giken going in tomorrow.

Did you guys see the 3/20 change proposals? Think they would spell the end end for us or am I being pessimistic? :confused:

Brendan 03-24-2020 07:47 AM

https://www.scca.com/pages/fastrack-news
I welcome everything except the turbo BMWs Inc the Supra. If they do let them in I wouldn't sell my car or anything. I'm way too attached. I would just build it for a different class. Maybe that new XS class is where I'll end up, or focus more on open track/time attack where it appears a wider a variety of cars can be competitive.

It would be hard to match the power to weight ratio of the new turbo stuff within the limits of stu.

gomer_110 03-24-2020 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brendan (Post 3917745)
https://www.scca.com/pages/fastrack-news
I welcome everything except the turbo BMWs Inc the Supra. If they do let them in I wouldn't sell my car or anything. I'm way too attached. I would just build it for a different class. Maybe that new XS class is where I'll end up, or focus more on open track/time attack where it appears a wider a variety of cars can be competitive.

It would be hard to match the power to weight ratio of the new turbo stuff within the limits of stu.

If you're moving classes, I hear BSP is a ton of fun.

Brendan 03-24-2020 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomer_110 (Post 3917814)
If you're moving classes, I hear BSP is a ton of fun.

I'm def open to it. The only reservation I have is the logistics of r-comps. Maybe a tire trailer would be the key. We'll see.

ConekillerZ34 03-24-2020 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brendan (Post 3917745)
https://www.scca.com/pages/fastrack-news
I welcome everything except the turbo BMWs Inc the Supra. If they do let them in I wouldn't sell my car or anything. I'm way too attached. I would just build it for a different class. Maybe that new XS class is where I'll end up, or focus more on open track/time attack where it appears a wider a variety of cars can be competitive.

It would be hard to match the power to weight ratio of the new turbo stuff within the limits of stu.

I mostly agree here, it's the addition of a bunch of new cars that would shake things up moreso than the other rule changes. New participants would be nice but not at the expense of the current participants, that's how I see it.

I don't wanna run R-comps to go to BSP :(
It'll probably be fine particularly if folks write in letters with nuanced thoughts, but I can't just sell this car so if things go that south I too would move into a different competition and away from autocross (which would be opposite of their goal of increasing participation).

Brendan 03-24-2020 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ConekillerZ34 (Post 3917933)
I mostly agree here, it's the addition of a bunch of new cars that would shake things up moreso than the other rule changes. New participants would be nice but not at the expense of the current participants, that's how I see it.

I don't wanna run R-comps to go to BSP :(
It'll probably be fine particularly if folks write in letters with nuanced thoughts, but I can't just sell this car so if things go that south I too would move into a different competition and away from autocross (which would be opposite of their goal of increasing participation).

the nice thing is we probably wont see too many even if they allow them in the class. its the same reason why there were only two cayman out there at nats last year. the car may be dominant, but they also perform really well stock with just tires. for a lot of owners it doesn't make sense to spend possibly $10k to do something unproven when the car can win in the street class. so if they let them in it will be 2021 season and then maybe another year or 2 before somebody develops a competitive platform and ruins everything lol.

ConekillerZ34 03-24-2020 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomer_110 (Post 3917814)
If you're moving classes, I hear BSP is a ton of fun.

Gomer, do you think we can manage 315 square in STU trim on 11s?
I've seen your involvement in other older threads about running 315s on the front on 10s with what appear to be unmodified fenders, but I was unclear if that was on a car that was lowered or not. Also, I ultimately suspect wheel fitment and offset to be a larger problem than tire in this respect but I could be wrong.

gomer_110 03-24-2020 08:02 PM

Mine is not that much lower than stock and the fenders when I was on the 315's were stock. I think the only real trick for 315's on 11's square is just getting the right offset.

fwiw I've moved on from the 315's to 335's on 18x12's. That's where you'll have to cut the fenders to get things to fit.

Hotrodz 03-24-2020 09:44 PM

I don't auto x but I run 315 square on 18x11 +18 with no modifications. I am lowered as well.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

ConekillerZ34 03-24-2020 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hotrodz (Post 3918034)
I don't auto x but I run 315 square on 18x11 +18 with no modifications. I am lowered as well.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

THIS is what I like to hear. I think the 11s are going to be pretty much a requirement for fitment and competitiveness if we have end up going 315 square, nice to know they'll fit if I can manage the camber.

Unfortunately we can't run SPL stuff yet so I hope we can reach any requisite fitment on Z1 arms.

Brendan 03-25-2020 03:52 PM

$396 per tire lol

gomer_110 03-25-2020 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brendan (Post 3918300)

Only $21 more per tire and you could be running Hoosiers.

Brendan 03-26-2020 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomer_110 (Post 3918332)
Only $21 more per tire and you could be running Hoosiers.

off topic, but besides hoosiers, which bsp allowance do you think the z34 benefits from the most?

gomer_110 03-26-2020 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brendan (Post 3918492)
off topic, but besides hoosiers, which bsp allowance do you think the z34 benefits from the most?

The aero. Until I added aero, I would have sworn there was no way it would make that much of a difference. After adding aero, I wouldn't want to go back. It just keeps the car settled through the higher speed stuff while keeping the car loose enough for slow speed stuff.

Mn23 04-04-2020 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hotrodz (Post 3918034)
I don't auto x but I run 315 square on 18x11 +18 with no modifications. I am lowered as well.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

What kind of front camber is needed to run 18x11 +18?

Hotrodz 04-04-2020 09:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mn23 (Post 3921458)
What kind of front camber is needed to run 18x11 +18?

I run -3 to -3.5 with just a little toe and 6.5 caster. If you under -3 run more caster.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Brendan 05-11-2020 11:00 AM

Video from my practice event yesterday. So happy to be back to racing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w9yig8uiXBY

Car is driving very nicely with all the changes. With the seat in the car I have enough confidence to put a rear bar back on. We'll see how it goes.

ConekillerZ34 05-21-2020 03:27 PM

3 Attachment(s)
MCS Installed!

Attachment 142604

At first, Vorshlag didn't include an upper perch for my rear divorced spring with my initial MCS package. After a lot of rather unfortunate miscommunication, they are sending a newly designed component, but I'm going to continue to use this SPL version instead. Big shout-out to Turner + crew at SPL for getting their upper perch (usually only sold as part of the midlink kit) to me with overnight shipping -- rather cheaply too.
Attachment 142602
Attachment 142603

Brendan 05-26-2020 05:52 PM

Season is off to a good start. I took second by a few tenths at the opener losing to an e92 but beating out a few other well/full prepped examples. Data and video show there was more time out there. Car is driving great but I always say that lol. The longer travel and lower ride feel great. With two events down I feel confident that the seat was the component I was really missing to get the car to another level competitively.

Video attached. Apologies for the sound quality. we'll see if the windslayer helps.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNvRlwx2dS0

my biggest competition locally is the 2019 spring national winning e46 driven by my buddy but it was sidelined at this event. I hope to have a chance to benchmark soon.

ConekillerZ34 06-03-2020 03:43 PM

Anyone headed to the Bristol Champ tour? Reg opened today, just signed up.

Brendan 06-18-2020 10:49 AM

I think Nationals will be the only travel I get in this year. We may get our champ tour and pro solo back in Colorado if we secure a new site so maybe even lest travel after that.

DarkJak 06-22-2020 09:24 AM

Is there anyone else trying to make SUR4G (drift compound size 275/40R18) work for AutoX?
I love them on the track, and on the wallet, and don't yet have the budget for a second set of autoX wheels/tires. If I did, A052 no doubt.

They can get competitive if the stars align, otherwise peak grip feels noticeably less than RE's:
-Hot dry day
-Longer faster course
-Codriver
-Short wait between runs

I'm contemplating whether tire blankets would make a significant difference in keeping them up to temp.

ConekillerZ34 06-22-2020 10:33 PM

I saw people trying them out at the Dixie tour back in the year of their original release, but I don't think I ever heard of the compound beating an equivalent RE-71R. Regardless, the step down from 285 isn't helping so it would have to be a stellar compound to make up for that and I haven't heard that it is (again, secondhand knowledge only).

That said, if your budget is a higher priority than shaving a little time at a national event, that price looks NICE.

Brendan 06-25-2020 07:11 PM

revised proposal is out. I'm pretty indifferent about the new cars (no a90 supra) but 315 would be fun.

Quote:

Street Touring Category
#28321 Make STU Great Again!
The STAC is seeking member feedback on a more refined proposal to renew interest in STU and modernize the Street Touring ruleset overall. An initial proposal was published in the April 2020 Fastrack and the STAC has further refined that proposal based on input received. There was generally positive feedback and the STAC hopes that the following revisions will address some of the concerns that were received. The STAC highly encourages individuals to write letters with feedback on the revised proposal.
Changes from the previously published proposal are as follows:
• Restricting AWD and mid/rear-engine cars to 295 tires
• An additional allowance for charge pipe replacement as many cars struggle with charge pipe failure with elevated boost levels
• Clutch allowance is available to all vehicles but requires stock flywheel to keep from being a must-do modification
• Toyota Supra is now on the "maybe one day" list of cars as the STAC felt the performance was too much for the current class
The changes are outlined below:
Wheel and Tire Size Changes
14.3 TIRES
Tires must meet the eligibility requirements of the Street category with the following additional restrictions:
Tires shall have a section width up to and including the following (mm):
STR (AWD), STS .................................................. .............................225
STX (AWD), STH (AWD)............................................. .........................245
STR (2WD)............................................. ...........................................255
STU (AWD & 2WD mid- or rear-engine), STX (2WD), STH (2WD)..............265
STU (AWD & RWD forced induction)........................................ ..........295
STU (RWD N/A & FWD).............................................. ...................315
Intercooler and Charge Pipe Allowance Expansion
14.10.C
1. The air intake system up to, but not including, the engine inlet may be modified or replaced. The engine inlet is the throttle body, carburetor, compressor inlet, or intake manifold, whichever comes first.
SCCA Fastrack News July 2020 Page 3
The existing structure of the car may not be modified for the passage of ducting from the air cleaner to the engine inlet. Holes may be drilled for mounting. Emissions or engine management components in the air intake system, such as a PCV valve or mass airflow sensor, may not be removed, modified, or replaced, and must retain their original function along the flow path.
2. STH only: As utilized only on engines originally equipped with forced induction, induction charge heat exchangers (also known as “intercoolers” or “charge air coolers” [CACs]) are unrestricted in size and shape. Air-to-air CACs and radiators for air-to-liquid CACs must be cooled only by the atmosphere except for standard parts. Body panels, fascias, or structural members may not be cut or altered to facilitate CAC installation. Removal of vehicle components to facilitate installation is not allowed. Holes may be drilled for mounting. Factory boost piping may not be modified or replaced.
3. Charge pipes may be modified or replaced. Replacement charge pipes may delete or block off factory pipes designed to enhance intake sounds (“noisemakers”). Modification or deletion of vehicle components (e.g. plastic shrouds, wheel well liners) to permit routing of alternate charge pipes is not allowed.
Boost Controls Allowance
14.10.C
3. Compressor Bypass Valves (CBVs), blow-off valves, and pop-off valves may be replaced or modified.
4. Boost regulation systems, either electronic or mechanical, and electronic fuel cuts referencing boost pressure may be modified, replaced, or removed. This allowance does not allow for changes to the turbocharger or wastegate.
Clutch Allowance
14.10.O
The clutch disk and pressure plate may be modified or replaced.
Transmission Tuning
14.10.P
The Transmission Control Unit (TCU) may be re-programmed. This allowance only applies to modification of transmission behaviors and does not extend to re-programming any other components.
Electronic Differential Tuning
14.10.Q
Electronic differentials may be re-programmed. This allowance only applies to changing differential behaviors and does not extend to re-programming any other components.
Replacement of Differential in AWD vehicles
14.10.K.2
STU, STR, STX, and STH classes: Only standard (as defined in Section 12) limited slip differentials (LSD) are allowed on AWD vehicles. For AWD vehicles that did not come with any type of limited slip differential (including center differential or transfer case), a single aftermarket mechanical LSD may be added. 2WD vehicles may use any mechanical LSD unit. AWD vehicles may substitute one differential (front, rear, or center) with an aftermarket mechanical LSD.
Appendix A Changes to STU Listings
Audi
RS3
RS4
RS4
BMW
228 (2015-2015) 2 Series (non-M) (2014-2020)
SCCA Fastrack News July 2020 Page 4
M235i (2014-2016)
4 series (non-M) (2014-2020)
3 Series (E9x chassis, NOC inc. M3) (2006-2013)
3 series (non-M) (2014-2020)
M2 (except Performance Edition ZL9) (2016-2018)
M3 (2000-2020)
M4 (2014-2020)
M Coupe (2006-2008)
Ford
Focus RS (2016-2017 2018)
Porsche
Cayman S (981) (2013-2016)

ConekillerZ34 06-25-2020 09:36 PM

Glad to see the tire changes for mid and rear-engined cars even though I hadn't written a letter yet. Also glad to see the supra out for now, but I still worry a bit about the 981caymans -- perhaps the tire differential will mitigate that. However, I still think all-told this leaves the M2 as too much of a potential overdog. I suppose we'll see - maybe there's no way they can match our tire fitment; the Z does tend to fair pretty well in that regard.

Brendan 07-08-2020 08:57 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o53E2yL18WE
I should have known better. This was around 1/2 tank, maybe a little less. I had starved a few times before always in big rt hand sweepers, but with so many right turns this was way worse. Gonna have to look elsewhere for weight savings:p

ConekillerZ34 09-17-2020 12:38 PM

4 events in (all on asphalt -- Bristol, Philly, Bristol 2.0, local BMW club), I've learned that this car is *difficult* to drive at the limit. It's really loose, and right now probably just too stiff for 285s, particularly in the rear. Even on a tight local course, my codriver (a DSP contender) and I were running fairly mid-range MCS settings on the front dampers and basically bottoming out the rear.

I'm at 1000lb/800lb with factory Nismo bars, and disconnecting the rear at the midday break of our local event certainly helped -- not enough to balance the rear damper settings back upwards though. First I'll be going for some bar changes. I find it ridiculous that the front and rear bars on this car are both 27mm. I would have tossed it out ages ago knowing that. Potentially softer springs if that's not enough of a fix, and if we don't move to 315s next year.

We also found ourselves instantly getting ABS while braking out of a faster sweeper. At first I assumed I'd finally encountered the issue everyone has been complaining about despite having a factory diff cover and HPS pads, but it sounds like the opposite of that problem given the previous discussion.

When I got home, I found some oil spewing out of a loose sandwich plate fitting and probably on to the front right corner, likely getting to the tire and/or brake disc, which coincidentally would have been under the most load at the time. For now I'll attribute the ABS to that unless you guys have other thoughts...

gomer_110 09-17-2020 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ConekillerZ34 (Post 3960307)
4 events in (all on asphalt -- Bristol, Philly, Bristol 2.0, local BMW club), I've learned that this car is *difficult* to drive at the limit. It's really loose, and right now probably just too stiff for 285s, particularly in the rear. Even on a tight local course, my codriver (a DSP contender) and I were running fairly mid-range MCS settings on the front dampers and basically bottoming out the rear.

I'm at 1000lb/800lb with factory Nismo bars, and disconnecting the rear at the midday break of our local event certainly helped -- not enough to balance the rear damper settings back upwards though. First I'll be going for some bar changes. I find it ridiculous that the front and rear bars on this car are both 27mm. I would have tossed it out ages ago knowing that. Potentially softer springs if that's not enough of a fix, and if we don't move to 315s next year.

We also found ourselves instantly getting ABS while braking out of a faster sweeper. At first I assumed I'd finally encountered the issue everyone has been complaining about despite having a factory diff cover and HPS pads, but it sounds like the opposite of that problem given the previous discussion.

When I got home, I found some oil spewing out of a loose sandwich plate fitting and probably on to the front right corner, likely getting to the tire and/or brake disc, which coincidentally would have been under the most load at the time. For now I'll attribute the ABS to that unless you guys have other thoughts...

Your spring rates don't seem that out of line compared to others. Get yourself a Hotchkis front bar and lose the rear. It's shocking how much better it makes the car.

Zewerr 09-19-2020 06:25 PM

How much camber and toe are you running front and rear? I never experienced my car being difficult to drive unless it's on old tires. I built it, though, with keeping it easily drivable at the limit in mind, but don't think I'm far different from others.

ConekillerZ34 09-21-2020 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zewerr (Post 3960840)
How much camber and toe are you running front and rear? I never experienced my car being difficult to drive unless it's on old tires. I built it, though, with keeping it easily drivable at the limit in mind, but don't think I'm far different from others.

-3.5F, -2.5R, give or take. Toe is 1/8in out at front, 1/8in in at rear. Some toe changes could benefit the rear, but perhaps at the sacrifice of camber spec given our LCA adjustment?

I think the main thing is going to be the bar changes though. The front feels great, and the car transfers nicely during slaloms and such, but I should really be able to put more power down in sweepers and through harsh transfers. Offset gates on the bumpy bristol asphalt were nightmare material.

DarkJak 09-22-2020 05:18 PM

Stiff front bar (Hotchkis) and a mechanical LSD helped a ton for me.
I was happy with corner entry and mid corner balance, but had to be super gentle to put power down because the VLSD was pretty much worthless and the inner tire had so little weight on it.
So the stiff front/no rear helped the inner rear stay on the ground a ton, while the LSD make sure I was powering out with the outer tire too.
The improvement in corner exit was well worth it.

gomer_110 09-22-2020 05:43 PM

Just make sure the LSD is a clutch type. A Quaife just won't work with the unloaded inside rear.

2011 Nismo#91 09-23-2020 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gomer_110 (Post 3961481)
Just make sure the LSD is a clutch type. A Quaife just won't work with the unloaded inside rear.

Wavetec is an option too, I use the Quaife just because it's maintenance free and didn't know about Wavetec at the time I bought it.

ConekillerZ34 09-23-2020 11:45 AM

I have an OS Giken so no worries there. I suspect the bar changes will put things to bed, especially if we end up on even more tire next year.

Evildky 12-20-2020 01:27 PM

I'll be building my 13 Nismo to STU for the coming year. Lots of options trying to decide on so many bits. It's amazing how many choices there are for headers, cats, camber arms, diffs, and suspension. and trying to figure out what offset I need to run 19x11 square.


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