Nissan blew it with me

cossie1600

I completely understand what you are complaining about and in some small ways I agree with you. At the same time, you just come across as someone who is extremely offensive, ignorant and narcissistic. Just because the general public doesn't agree with you, it makes everyone a girl or a puss? Based on the sales numbers from the SUV world, maybe you should realize you are in the minority, male or female. Most people want SUV that is safe, comfortable and efficient. Most of the offroading SUVs get now are at the local strip mall or on their own lawn. If you don't like where the industry is going, go design your own car. Or you can always get a diesel truck and put two giant exhaust pipes out the truck bed. I am sure you will look tough and gain plenty of attention.......from guys.

What else are you going to blame women? Unemployment? Illegal immigration? Economy? Middle East? Also are you going to call all the VDC users a puss too? How about people wearing seatbelts?

Inspector71

In my years I have found that people who jump to conclusions about others they don't know, in this case, you, often, not always but often project their own personality characteristics onto others. To wit, the majority of posters here, including the pms I received, suggested alternatives to the Pathfinder, understood the humor, and were no way offended. This is what leads people like you to misread my intent and jump to conclusions. As far as narcissim goes, it is you that impute all sorts of cliched motives to me, engage in ad hominem insults simply because I have a different perspective than you, claim to speak for the general public, and overreact to what was a post met mostly in jest. Everyone else but you and one other poster got it. Of course I'm in the minority. If you actually read my post, you would have realized that I tip my hat to the free market system and the fact that Nissan must chase profits in building what customers want. That does not change the fact that they are not always right, otherwise, why would they build what the majority did not want? or that there are millions who want an SUV without the gugaws that appeal to women not men. Many automotive industry writers have also lamented the chickification of cars, which by the way, automotive designers focus group test with female buyers, hence the term, and fortunately, there remain alternatives. Do you really believe that Nissan is omiscient in killing the Pathfinder? Can you say Rogue, Murano, Juke?

Your semi-hysterical fear of not being "manly" even though I never suggested that, is obviously autobiographical. The only way, and pay attention this time, you could jump to such a conclusion, is if you have insecurities about your own masculinity. Otherwise, how could you and that other poster have jumped to screaming about what is a real man. No one, including me even posted anything suggesting that and yet this is how you to chose to inerpret what I posted. May I make a suggestion, innocence doesn't shout with cries of injury but the guilty do. Perhaps you like the new chickified Pathfinder and, me exposing this and you and that other poster liking the vehicle, have been exposed. Think about it before you engage in insult and ad hominem conclusions about someone you don't even know. Think about it before you indulge in your hackneyed politically correct cliches. They have the depth of intellectual integrity as the juvenile occupy wall street folks.

nuTinmuch

The problem is your argument is flawed -- cars have been long associated with masculine needs more than feminine (at least when it comes to advertising), and this is easily seen when you look at studies or data that genders vehicle purchases.

The Top 10 Most Popular Car Brands With Men and Women - Forbes

Yes, it's true that more women buy SUVs than men, but compare the percentages to the male-favored cars.

Basically, what I'm saying is the whole "chickification" argument is ********. I'm absolutely sure women have been part of the focus groups that these cars have passed through, but they haven't been the solitary factor in their development. The only car company you can claim that for is Volvo (who employees more women in their development process than any other manufacturer, iirc).

The reason SUVs are getting "softer" is more nuanced: fuel economy and a lack of interest in the traditional "sport" qualities that accompany SUVs. In other words, when was the last time you saw someone take an SUV offroad? Chance are if you have, it's been a Jeep or a purpose-built vehicle -- or maybe a SUV from the 90s with a bunch of retrofits.

The Juke doesn't exist because women. It exists because there's no longer a need to produce a vehicle that goes offroad. There's no want for that. There is, however, a want for "all-weather" (market perception -- not me) vehicles that are "capable" and are able to have the same utility that, say, the 90s wagons did (also why you're seeing a resurgence in wagons).

Now, you've said as much -- but you seem to be associating the changes with what women want when it's more what the market itself wants. That's why the term "chickification" is stupid. It's like calling the 50s/60s the "rockification" of music because everyone started using electric guitars, ignoring that those needs/wants existed ages before rock ever did.

But even if you were right, even if SUVs were being designed primarily for women... my answer, I guess, would be to deal with it. Cars have been primarily designed by/for men for literally a century. I'm sure the very existence of a few not-so-grr-tough SUVs won't hurt you.

__________________
nuTinmuch! -- Platinum Graphite 370Z -- Check out my Gallery thread here!

UNKNOWN_370

So true...



There is no point in this post I can't disagree with. Well written and a total Ignorance-Stopper.

Inspector71

Is that you talking or the voice of your inner woman...Oprah.

Inspector71

I understasnd what you are saying but I don't think my argument was flawed as it was no argument. What I posted was a tongue-in-cheek lament (perhaps too "nuanced" for those nursing certain insecurities) not an argument. If you read my posts you will see:

I don't advocate a change
I recognize market forces cannot be ignored
Nissan must follow the market
But, they went too far. They have cross overs in several models.

I am not the one who invented the term "chickification" of SUVS. Automotive writes have discussed it for years. They have noted that in some cases for a husband to buy his truck/suv it must have certain features that appeal to women. I am old enough to remember when SUVs could be ordered without carpets which makes sense for people like me. The chickification of cars most certainly includes "softer" or feminine touches if you prefer. that appeal to women more than men. Seat warmers, soft rides, etc. My wife is a perfect example as she favors the feminie touches which have more to do with comfort than performance. I think you missed by point with the Juke. What I was stating to another poster was that Nissan already has three cross over vehicles, Juke, Murano, and Rogue, The new Pathfinder is morphing into that direction but may stop short and evolve? into a soccer mom van.
Once again, I wonder about the motives of people who respond when they feel the need to insult and engage in ad hominem attack. Calling me stupid because you disagree is no argument. It is no class. You could disagree with everything I said and I would respect you. But the name calling ruins a good argument and you made a good one. I stick with what I believe having watching this evolution from the 1980s on, and from what automotive writers write themselves. the chickification of automobiles is being executed to appeal, as you noted, to the feminine market, who share different tastes from men. I can't help it if some posters are offended. It would seem they have issues better addressed in a different setting.

Inspector71

Go back and read your posts. You and that other poster, based on me using the word "chick" (which I will continue to use whether you like it or not) jumped to all sorts of conclusions about me being stupid, out of date, a neanderthal, want to take the vote away from women, and more. This from people who don't even know me. That suggests a political tripwire from which your world view operates.

Angry, I am laughing. I find you hysterical. Dropped the "C" bomb??? What has happened to manhood in America. Let me lay it out as simple as I can, two "male" posters are outraged and furious because I used the word "chick." Two "males." Jeff Cooper must be turning over in his grave. You know, it is okay to disagree and tell me why I'm wrong without devolving into name calling and mockery but, I guess that is part of your nature.

cossie1600

So I am jumping to conclusion after you dropped 4 c bombs in your first post alone? One or two, it's funny and it's all for good fun. The more you kept going, the more you made yourself sound like an angry old man.

I am sure you get plenty of support, except none of them are buying the vehicles. The bottom line is what drives car design at the end of the day. Bringing the sex card will only get you so far and you just make yourself sound like a fool.