curious just how much of a diff does a superior car make?

brucelidat · 02-26-2012, 01:56 AM

So basically, you'd have to be a pretty advanced driver in a Z to be faster than a semi-competent (not good, but not terrible, maybe has a few days of exp) guy in a GT-R?

shadoquad · 02-26-2012, 02:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cossie1600

Its really hard to make up nearly 160hp and awd traction. I have a datalog between both caes. You will be amazed at how mucj faster the gtr is. You just need a semi competent driver

But I'm sure you agree that driver skill and experience can make up quite a bit of difference. You've logged some seat time.

brucelidat · 02-26-2012, 02:09 AM

well, I guess if you're on the track at the same time and the GT-R is behind you, it would be pretty hard to beat him since he could just follow your lines and punch it past you on a straight...

brucelidat · 02-26-2012, 02:11 AM

at my first track day ever, i was behind my friend who is a better driver in his old miata, and I followed his lines and passed him on the straight since i have like triple his power, but he passed me again after a few more turns, haha.

kenchan · 02-26-2012, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brucelidat

at my first track day ever, i was behind my friend who is a better driver in his old miata, and I followed his lines and passed him on the straight since i have like triple his power, but he passed me again after a few more turns, haha.

Did he say "too soon junior!" ?

cossie1600 · 02-26-2012, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brucelidat

So basically, you'd have to be a pretty advanced driver in a Z to be faster than a semi-competent (not good, but not terrible, maybe has a few days of exp) guy in a GT-R?

Yes, but too many variable. That's why you are better off comparing lap times rather than positioning on the track. Also to their defense, I would assume for most people it is harder to push a 80K car vs. a 30K car.

I am not sure how familiar you are with reading telemetry. Here is a picture of a lap comparing this guy's GT-R and my best run. You can see exactly where I am gaining and losing time to him on the graph below. And I know for a fact he was another sec or two quicker when he was following me when I did my best lap. Also he was nowhere close to the edge when he pushed for the time below.

Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Mt Tam I am · 02-26-2012, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brucelidat

So I was at the track today, I'm a newbie BTW, and notice there are is a huge assortment of cars with major variations in power out there at the same time (my beginner group had plenty of vettes, a ferrari, GTR, 2 CTS-Vs, etc.) So it got me thinking, the GT-R is obviously superior to the Z in every way (except looks IMO), but would a newbie like me be significantly faster in one? Just how big of a difference does that superior power and handling make? Would a novice GTR driver be faster than an intermediate Z driver? Would a GTR driver with just a few track days of exp be faster than an intermediate or higher level Z driver? I am just curious because basically anytime see a GTR behind me, I'm already looking ahead tot he next passing zone to let him by. Any thoughts on this form guys who have maybe tracked both or at least 2 cars that ar eon 2 very different levels of performance?

I did a track day in August. My first with the Z. I took a half day class in a Formula 3 car before this. Not very similar. Race school day.

A GTR was present. Our test to get on the track was a cone course. The GTR driver was lagging until the final timed event and took third. Cones are not the same as open tracking, but this was the result.

Oddly enough I saw this car yesterday for the first time. I was waiting at a 5 minute red light when I saw a GTR stop behind me I gave him the thumbs up. He got out and said I know you. Sure enough he is the same GTR from Sears Point. He never sent photos of my car he took in August so I hope he sends them this time.

ZSIZZLE · 02-26-2012, 09:00 AM

i run a nissan dealership and i have about 20 trackdays under my belt with a 500whp bmw m6, now i have taken many customers to track days with there gtr's and they consistently put up times close to or better than much more experienced drivers in other cars. you still have to break properly and hit your apex but the gtr makes it easier to do it, you take a bad line and try to force a correction the gtr makes it easier, the other big thing is the throttle and the car rotating, my m6 i gotta baby the gas pedal in 2nd out of a turn, in the gtr its mash and go!!!! a tenth faster here a tenth faster there, a few tenths worth of good shifting and the car will mask allot!!!

ZSIZZLE · 02-26-2012, 09:03 AM

also all you have to look at is the ring times, the gtr is like number 4 out of every car on the planet that way allot less and have way more power, thats including your enzo's, carerra gt, italia, mp412c, all the hyper cars!!!! the zr1,viper, and a couple of others beat the gtr

Mt Tam I am · 02-26-2012, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZSIZZLE

i run a nissan dealership and i have about 20 trackdays under my belt with a 500whp bmw m6, now i have taken many customers to track days with there gtr's and they consistently put up times close to or better than much more experienced drivers in other cars. you still have to break properly and hit your apex but the gtr makes it easier to do it, you take a bad line and try to force a correction the gtr makes it easier, the other big thing is the throttle and the car rotating, my m6 i gotta baby the bag pedal in 2nd out of a turn, in the gtr its mash and go!!!! a tenth faster here a tenth faster there, a few tenths worth of good shifting and the car will mask allot!!!

Why keep the M6? Why not get your own GTR?

PS. - which pedal is the bag pedal? I assume gas.

shadoquad · 02-26-2012, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZSIZZLE

also all you have to look at is the ring times, the gtr is like number 4 out of every car on the planet that way allot less and have way more power, thats including your enzo's, carerra gt, italia, mp412c, all the hyper cars!!!! the zr1,viper, and a couple of others beat the gtr

Once again, who is setting those ring times that people love to cite?

Professional drivers, going all-out 10/10ths of their ability.

Yes, it is one indicator of a car's performance potential. But a 7.5 minute ring time can't make a scrub faster on a track.

Gauge · 02-26-2012, 11:11 AM

I have never driven a GTR, only read ton and tons of reviews from people who have. One of the things that is almost universal is how easy it is for a novice to get in an do amazing around a track. The electronics in that car are just so dang good.

I'm not even thinking about the HP difference. I will, of course, yield to the experts here. Just tossing in my 2 cents.

Nick911sc · 02-26-2012, 11:22 AM

My father has a GT-R that I've driven on multiple occasions. I will admit that a novice driver will be able to do decent in it. But, the car will not figure out weight distribution in and out of corners, proper lines etc. (which have all been mentioned in the thread). But that's not to say it will make the car easier to drive. It takes a truly good driver to use all the technological gadgets in the GT-R to their advantage.

Lemers · 02-26-2012, 11:34 AM

The GTR goes beyond Simple HP numbers. It's like setting a race video game on easy. Can it be beat? yes. Here's what I can tell you the same driver does laps in a GTR then in a Z. I'm betting on the GTR laps being faster.

ZSIZZLE · 02-27-2012, 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mt Tam I am

Why keep the M6? Why not get your own GTR?

PS. - which pedal is the bag pedal? I assume gas.

As much as the Gtr capabilities blow me away, for my personal taste its not what i like. I dont like awd because it takes some of the thrill away from driving and i dont like the dct even though i know its faster because it feels like an automatic. Now if i was out to win races and break records the gtr would def be my weapon of choice. But for what i wanna enjoy on the street or track give me rwd anx a stick all day long.

02-26-2012, 01:56 AM	#16 (permalink)
brucelidat A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: temple city, ca Posts: 2,432 Drives: 2011 370z 7AT GM Sp Rep Power: 30	So basically, you'd have to be a pretty advanced driver in a Z to be faster than a semi-competent (not good, but not terrible, maybe has a few days of exp) guy in a GT-R? __________________ Works Emotion CR Ultimate - FI CBE w/ 18" resonators - Ecutek - eibach sways - Quaife - FI LTH w/race cats - kw v3 - spl - Topgunz SC - 488whp 398trq

02-26-2012, 02:09 AM	#18 (permalink)
brucelidat A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: temple city, ca Posts: 2,432 Drives: 2011 370z 7AT GM Sp Rep Power: 30	well, I guess if you're on the track at the same time and the GT-R is behind you, it would be pretty hard to beat him since he could just follow your lines and punch it past you on a straight... __________________ Works Emotion CR Ultimate - FI CBE w/ 18" resonators - Ecutek - eibach sways - Quaife - FI LTH w/race cats - kw v3 - spl - Topgunz SC - 488whp 398trq

02-26-2012, 02:11 AM	#19 (permalink)
brucelidat A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: temple city, ca Posts: 2,432 Drives: 2011 370z 7AT GM Sp Rep Power: 30	at my first track day ever, i was behind my friend who is a better driver in his old miata, and I followed his lines and passed him on the straight since i have like triple his power, but he passed me again after a few more turns, haha. __________________ Works Emotion CR Ultimate - FI CBE w/ 18" resonators - Ecutek - eibach sways - Quaife - FI LTH w/race cats - kw v3 - spl - Topgunz SC - 488whp 398trq

02-26-2012, 09:00 AM	#23 (permalink)
ZSIZZLE Base Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: NY Posts: 73 Drives: BMW M6 Rep Power: 14	i run a nissan dealership and i have about 20 trackdays under my belt with a 500whp bmw m6, now i have taken many customers to track days with there gtr's and they consistently put up times close to or better than much more experienced drivers in other cars. you still have to break properly and hit your apex but the gtr makes it easier to do it, you take a bad line and try to force a correction the gtr makes it easier, the other big thing is the throttle and the car rotating, my m6 i gotta baby the gas pedal in 2nd out of a turn, in the gtr its mash and go!!!! a tenth faster here a tenth faster there, a few tenths worth of good shifting and the car will mask allot!!! Last edited by ZSIZZLE; 02-27-2012 at 08:32 AM.

02-26-2012, 11:34 AM	#29 (permalink)
Lemers A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Izmir, Turkey Posts: 15,371 Drives: 2012 Traverse LTZ Rep Power: 52	The GTR goes beyond Simple HP numbers. It's like setting a race video game on easy. Can it be beat? yes. Here's what I can tell you the same driver does laps in a GTR then in a Z. I'm betting on the GTR laps being faster. __________________ 2010 Black Cherry Touring/Sport/Nav Now - 2012 Travese LTZ until I leave for Turkey

02-26-2012, 09:03 AM	#24 (permalink)
ZSIZZLE Base Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: NY Posts: 73 Drives: BMW M6 Rep Power: 14	also all you have to look at is the ring times, the gtr is like number 4 out of every car on the planet that way allot less and have way more power, thats including your enzo's, carerra gt, italia, mp412c, all the hyper cars!!!! the zr1,viper, and a couple of others beat the gtr

02-26-2012, 11:11 AM	#27 (permalink)
Gauge Track Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Madison WI Posts: 867 Drives: 2012 370Z Nismo PW Rep Power: 14	I have never driven a GTR, only read ton and tons of reviews from people who have. One of the things that is almost universal is how easy it is for a novice to get in an do amazing around a track. The electronics in that car are just so dang good. I'm not even thinking about the HP difference. I will, of course, yield to the experts here. Just tossing in my 2 cents.

02-26-2012, 11:22 AM	#28 (permalink)
Nick911sc A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Long Island, New York Posts: 1,698 Drives: 2010 Nissan GT-R Rep Power: 20	My father has a GT-R that I've driven on multiple occasions. I will admit that a novice driver will be able to do decent in it. But, the car will not figure out weight distribution in and out of corners, proper lines etc. (which have all been mentioned in the thread). But that's not to say it will make the car easier to drive. It takes a truly good driver to use all the technological gadgets in the GT-R to their advantage.

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