So the "German engineering" refers to the handling of BMWs, VWs, Audis, Porsche, Mercedes, etc. right? and obviously not the durability. If it was "Japanese engineering" it refers to the durability of the car. If it's "American engineering" it's about the "big-block, hp, torque more than a $300,000 Lamborghini at a fraction of the price" thing, right?

Bottom line, German cars aren't durable correct?...I like the 991 Porsche, but I don't see any quibbles about that car on here. Not trying to derail thread.

Did I just read the 5.0 out handles the Nismo? Is that true lol? I haven't been in a mustang since maybe an 08 one, but I can't imagine it out handling our Z's on the track

i did some research last night... something lightning lap or whatever had the 5.0 perform better than the nismo by a few seconds or something like that.

I'm hesitant to believe a solid rear has better cornerability than independent suspensions.

Ouchie, are you looking at only these two cars or are you also exploring other avenus? (c63 ?)

Porsches last, Benzos last. They're not the epitome of reliability but don't break down nearly as often as BMW,Audi & Volkswagen. BMW N/A engines are a little less problematic. I remember when VW was one of the most dependable? The good ole days.

Yep. It tied the M3 around Streets of Willow.

On a smooth track it can. Once the surface isn't perfect it begins to show its (many) flaws. Plus, some of it was the fact that it has much more torque, and can put it down better on corner exit since Z's have problems putting power down.

very interesting... i never noticed the Z not putting down power if your in the right gear at the right time... then again i've never taken it to a track.

but comparable power/torque cars like lets say the m3 or porche don't seem to have the same squirmish reaction or difficulting putting the rubber on the asphalt... any insight?

When the Z squats, the rear tires camber in quite a bit. It's good for handling to a point, but it definitely effects traction coming out of a corner or in a straight line, especially when you start getting above stock power levels.

Z can put its power down, but requires Upgrades most important LSD, fatter tiers and coilovers.

P.S. forgot to mention bushings, nissan bushings are terrible.

Right, so a stock Z has some issues in that area. Lightning Lap only tests stock vehicles.

well to their credit if you were to do a lsd/bushing/suspension on one car you'd have to do it on all cars... so doing stock only is a fair comparison as OEM VS OEM style battle.

then again I wouldn't touch the track until i get track pads + brake ducts installed for the front.

It really depends on you and what you like, how you feel about them...

I had the same debate too but then i switched my job from driving 3 miles/day (to the train station) to driving 50 miles a day, the thought about losing car values + gas usage from the V8 doesnt sound attractive anymore so i went with the Z and been happy since then (it's been only a month but still) :driving:

Not sure if you care about seating, but i came across this problem a few times when i needed to pickup the 3rd person and then i realized that the only spot i have for them would be either hanging on the roof or squeezing in the little "trunk" :gtfo2:

I've always thought those comparisons need to spec a tire for the manufacturers to use, otherwise it's borderline meaningless.

The worst thing I found on the stock Z was massive understeer in a high speed 90 degree turn. I really went too far out the the turn. I corrected with drop, alignment & n sways.

Ops sorry guys i did not know that stock only applies to that answer.

Anywhooo, my experience came when a friend of mine and i, desided to lease a 2011 135i bmw with N54 or N55 engine(i dont remember exactly) and JB it + various parts (inter cooler, exhaust, down pipe, intake ext.) Its a looong story of in and out of the shop and removing and putting the parts on (was done by us, i still remember how to wire the jb chip correctly i did it so many times) and the parts that went where electrical, transmission, clutch, oem exhaust falling off literally. And every time we left the bmw dealership they say its fixed, drive back car gets its normal operating temp( was like 310F, we thought to our selfs wtf the oil rated N.O.T. was 260F) and the burning wire smell is in the cabin again. In the end we found the wire that was burning( what happened is that it was like G1 or so wire running on the top of the engine which caused it to vibrate and bend on one fixed place caused to tear and develop election resistance and heated that spot, in the end we stopped goin to the dealer and went to electric supply store to buy wire and that problem never came back.) When we finnaly JB4 it, car made around 480whp, thats when real mechanical problems started( lasted us 2 weeks of jb4 pleasure ) in the end we just stopped driving it, it just stood in the driveway, 240sx was our dd/race commute again.

BMW Engineering SUUUUCCCKKKK!!!