my $.02 I was in the same boat as you:
CPO is basically "no warranty", if you get an E92 which is a hell of a car, you must get a good warranty, whatever goes wrong with the car will not be covered by CPO, it's a joke. Maintenance is very high, very high, I bought aftermarket warranties for all BMWs I've ever owned, worked out great, all repairs done at BMW.

The Z is a killer sports car, the M3 is not a sports car, far from, and sitting in it feels like a truck once you get used to sitting low to the ground. I truly don't recommend buying new cars, you lose your butt in depreciation, I would much rather get maybe a 2011-12 Nismo for under $30k and do some upgrades. I personally like to mod Japanese cars and leave German cars stock, it's already a b*tch to keep up with the maintenance of a German car.

As for speed, stuff on paper means nothing, I embarrass people driving M3s, GTRs, 911s, etc. it comes down to your driving skills, not to mention a Z with a good suspension setup can out handle anything.

Lastly, consider buying 2 cars, I personally don't like all-purpose anything

Owning a BMW is kind of like going to Vegas, you only say something when you win money, when you lose your a-s-s you stay very quiet ... there is absolutely no way that BMWs don't have issues at 60k miles especially with track days, these cars see the shop every other month for something, everything goes wrong with them, computer, electronics, bushings, seals, everything leaks in these cars even the radio (exaggerating) I mean these cars have issues at 5k miles, stupid stuff goes wrong with them, if you sneeze too loud the check light comes on. The people that tell you they don't have issues, simply don't keep up with the maintenance and drive the cars until the doors fall off, and pay no attention to everything the car needs. Try replacing a battery, you can't, that's right, the battery is not only expensive, but you have to program the battery so the car can read it and actually start. BMW and most shops charge $120-150 per hour of labor, so your battery can run you close to $500-600

My most recent BMW had approximately $12k in repairs in a 2.5 year period totaling 7 visits, I sold it only because the warranty was about to expire and they would not extend it since they knew how many issues I had.

Leasing is different story, the car has bumper to bumper warranty, so who cares if the engine blows up every other weekend at the track ... you will see most cars for sale right before or aorund 50k miles

The E92 M3 is certainly the better car on the track. It is only how long I can stay ahead until he is on me. This comes with a heavy financial cost too.

More for more. Good luck.

CPO e92 M3 with extended warranty then sell it before the warranty expires

Wow now there's people in here saying the Z embarrasses m3 vettes and stangs and can out handle anything... I would love to see this question asked on neutral forum. It would be a landslide picking m3

you should get the m3 cause you match bimmer profile perfectly.

Wow... Now I am more confused

you are getting fairly neutral comments that are very informative. you need to do a lot of research and DD...

Never let the warranty roll over or you are certfied - F'd.

My friend bought a 2012 M3, 6 speed manual a few months ago. 35K on the odometer for $40,000. Its quick too. Though how much quicker than a new 2015 NISMO...I bet its closer than you think. I like it. I dont love it. The interior is awful, other than the seats. Oh, its been in the shop longer than its been in his driveway. Id never buy a used M3. Ever.

Truth to all the shop time comments. We had our 335xi for 2 years and a few months. Outside of regular maintanence schedule the car was in the shop atleast a month for all the repairs we had to get done. About 2m onths if you include our maintanence and such. Not impressed... also had some douce level service department. Something about not having a scan code technician on site to read the codes (queue google?) on saturday, snobby service (i wasn't dressed like a bum), claiming they can't balance after market rims, and a whole other 'can't do that' loser attitude.

So the "German engineering" refers to the handling of BMWs, VWs, Audis, Porsche, Mercedes, etc. right? and obviously not the durability. If it was "Japanese engineering" it refers to the durability of the car. If it's "American engineering" it's about the "big-block, hp, torque more than a $300,000 Lamborghini at a fraction of the price" thing, right?

Bottom line, German cars aren't durable correct?...I like the 991 Porsche, but I don't see any quibbles about that car on here. Not trying to derail thread.

Did I just read the 5.0 out handles the Nismo? Is that true lol? I haven't been in a mustang since maybe an 08 one, but I can't imagine it out handling our Z's on the track

i did some research last night... something lightning lap or whatever had the 5.0 perform better than the nismo by a few seconds or something like that.

I'm hesitant to believe a solid rear has better cornerability than independent suspensions.

Ouchie, are you looking at only these two cars or are you also exploring other avenus? (c63 ?)

Porsches last, Benzos last. They're not the epitome of reliability but don't break down nearly as often as BMW,Audi & Volkswagen. BMW N/A engines are a little less problematic. I remember when VW was one of the most dependable? The good ole days.

Yep. It tied the M3 around Streets of Willow.

On a smooth track it can. Once the surface isn't perfect it begins to show its (many) flaws. Plus, some of it was the fact that it has much more torque, and can put it down better on corner exit since Z's have problems putting power down.

very interesting... i never noticed the Z not putting down power if your in the right gear at the right time... then again i've never taken it to a track.

but comparable power/torque cars like lets say the m3 or porche don't seem to have the same squirmish reaction or difficulting putting the rubber on the asphalt... any insight?

When the Z squats, the rear tires camber in quite a bit. It's good for handling to a point, but it definitely effects traction coming out of a corner or in a straight line, especially when you start getting above stock power levels.

Z can put its power down, but requires Upgrades most important LSD, fatter tiers and coilovers.

P.S. forgot to mention bushings, nissan bushings are terrible.

Right, so a stock Z has some issues in that area. Lightning Lap only tests stock vehicles.

well to their credit if you were to do a lsd/bushing/suspension on one car you'd have to do it on all cars... so doing stock only is a fair comparison as OEM VS OEM style battle.

then again I wouldn't touch the track until i get track pads + brake ducts installed for the front.

It really depends on you and what you like, how you feel about them...

I had the same debate too but then i switched my job from driving 3 miles/day (to the train station) to driving 50 miles a day, the thought about losing car values + gas usage from the V8 doesnt sound attractive anymore so i went with the Z and been happy since then (it's been only a month but still) :driving:

Not sure if you care about seating, but i came across this problem a few times when i needed to pickup the 3rd person and then i realized that the only spot i have for them would be either hanging on the roof or squeezing in the little "trunk" :gtfo2:

I've always thought those comparisons need to spec a tire for the manufacturers to use, otherwise it's borderline meaningless.

The worst thing I found on the stock Z was massive understeer in a high speed 90 degree turn. I really went too far out the the turn. I corrected with drop, alignment & n sways.

Ops sorry guys i did not know that stock only applies to that answer.

Anywhooo, my experience came when a friend of mine and i, desided to lease a 2011 135i bmw with N54 or N55 engine(i dont remember exactly) and JB it + various parts (inter cooler, exhaust, down pipe, intake ext.) Its a looong story of in and out of the shop and removing and putting the parts on (was done by us, i still remember how to wire the jb chip correctly i did it so many times) and the parts that went where electrical, transmission, clutch, oem exhaust falling off literally. And every time we left the bmw dealership they say its fixed, drive back car gets its normal operating temp( was like 310F, we thought to our selfs wtf the oil rated N.O.T. was 260F) and the burning wire smell is in the cabin again. In the end we found the wire that was burning( what happened is that it was like G1 or so wire running on the top of the engine which caused it to vibrate and bend on one fixed place caused to tear and develop election resistance and heated that spot, in the end we stopped goin to the dealer and went to electric supply store to buy wire and that problem never came back.) When we finnaly JB4 it, car made around 480whp, thats when real mechanical problems started( lasted us 2 weeks of jb4 pleasure ) in the end we just stopped driving it, it just stood in the driveway, 240sx was our dd/race commute again.

BMW Engineering SUUUUCCCKKKK!!!

You're correct in my opinion, my favorite car is the Porsche 911s both the 997 and 991 body now, if I were to get rid of my Z is to get a 997s maybe a 2007-2008 and put some insane warranty so I am not worried about those crazy repairs. At this time I can't drop $50k on the car and add another $5k in warranty and misc stuff, but that is the car.

Porsche 911 is actually the most reliable of the German sports cars, still doing a clutch is an arm and a leg and you have to get the bearing recall done as well on most models.

Leasing is probably the better option for German cars, you drive the hell out of them and enjoy them, 3 years later you get a new one and stick someone else with the problems

German cars = over engineered to be over priced

Nissan = Engineered just enough

I have a 370z and love it, but next to an E92 M3, I would go with the M3 without thinking twice.

^ I seen 2008 911 GT3s for around $80k. That car is tits! Pure track car without any frills, and very fast too. That's like Porsche's version of a FD3s R1/2 or a Ferrari F40. Pure sports.

Porsche over bimmer, hands down!

:iagree: bmws will never have the classic legendary looks of Porsches 911, they all look like tin can boxes with kidney grills to me. My brother has a 2009 4door m3 fast but felt very heavy compared to my z. bmw great performance, styling wise when you look at them :roflpuke2:

Can someone please take pictures of the Automatic pedals?

I almost bought a new 2012 M3 in 2013. I traveled to a dealer that had one in stock & discovered some "deal killer" things I didn't like. I was used to a 535i M Sport and had assumed that the M3 features would have been alike.
The "keyless" entry and ignition was only semi "keyless", you had to plug the fob into the dash before you push the start button.
The seats were narrow and hard, not something I'd like to take on a long trip. The leather was of a lower quality than the 535 too.
The turbo lag was the worst I even felt. The salesman agreed and said that was not normal and they would "fix" it.
Now I really dislike BMW's I-Drive system on the 535 because it is complicated menu driven with sub-menus, sub-sub menus, and more. To use it safely, you need to stop. The M3 was less complicated due to less features but it still took your eyes off the road for too long. The pre-set buttons under the radio are not just for the radio, they're programmable via the I-Drive system to perform any function you want from calling home on the cell phone to finding genre specific music.
The navigation unit was on par with units of several years ago. Not even touch screen.
That said, earlier this year I looked at the new 435i and liked it much better. The last I heard the M4 should be out soon. That would get my vote.

It already came out, I met a guy with one at a car show a few weeks back it was sick. But I'd probably get a used GTR over it

seen the 435 on the road since early summer... not bad still prefer the 335 over it.

still like the m3 over the m4 but i was lucky enough to see both an m4 and m5 side by side on the road. They're not bad but i still would get a c63 over either... then again if someone handed me the keys for free i wouldn't say no!

there is a picture of one in this thread :bowrofl:

theres a fella in town here who has one of the light blue m4s, dont like the color but it is a beautiful car. havent seen him at any of the meets yet. i believe he ordered it and drove it off the lot the first week they were available. i had an e36 m3 for a couple years, and i never had any money for mods because it was all spent on repairs! and this was a well maintained vehicle.

Uh... the E92 M3 is a 4.0L N/A V8?

Turbo lag was probably due to low blinker fluid. Would not buy.

You would be correct about the engine. I assumed it was turbo & the salesman didn't know any better either. Didn't BMW change the M3 to a turbo inline 6 later?

Nah the 335 is turbo inline 6, the m3 is a small block v8. the new m4 however is twin turbo 6 cy. Probably has more tuning options than the M3
but I've seen a few guys put a supercharger on their m3s and they were really quick.