Bad Driving Habits (M/T)

kenchan · 05-16-2011, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoopajae10

Dumb question, while in gear, is it bad if you dont clutch in to pop the stick back into neutral?

not bad at all. heck i do it all the time in my dd. basically while braking i blip the throttle just a hair and put into neutral without using the clutch.

you can even shift up without your clutch if you can get the rev's perfect.

shoopajae10 · 05-16-2011, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kenchan

not bad at all. heck i do it all the time in my dd. basically while braking i blip the throttle just a hair and put into neutral without using the clutch.

you can even shift up without your clutch if you can get the rev's perfect.

Well, since i have syncro rev match, and its rev's should be perfect all the time, i can do this on my 370z?

Im sure its not recommended, but would it hurt the transmission? would it even let me?

brado · 05-16-2011, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoopajae10

Well, since i have syncro rev match, and its rev's should be perfect all the time, i can do this on my 370z?

Im sure its not recommended, but would it hurt the transmission? would it even let me?

in tractor trailors you never have to use the clutch unless you are stopped. i dont know if its the same with cars though.

kenchan · 05-16-2011, 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoopajae10

Well, since i have syncro rev match, and its rev's should be perfect all the time, i can do this on my 370z?

Im sure its not recommended, but would it hurt the transmission? would it even let me?

Hahaha, not recommended but u can try it.

djpathfinder · 05-15-2011, 12:30 PM

I've never tried the handbrake technique. The backwards roll on hill starts always seems to be a lot, but really, most of the time you've likely rolled less than 6-12 inches.

EazyD · 05-16-2011, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by djpathfinder

most of the time you've likely rolled less than 6-12 inches.

-- and for getting out of parallel-parked spots (someone at a meter parked right behind you) practicing a hill-start beforehand is definitely a good confidence booster.

shadoquad · 05-16-2011, 09:49 AM

I don't mind wasting the gas to coast in neutral. I do it all the time, but generally when I do, I'm ready to react, foot hovering on clutch and brake.

Red__Zed · 05-16-2011, 06:50 PM

Doesn't synchro rev only work when the clutch is in?

kenchan · 05-16-2011, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Red__Zed

Doesn't synchro rev only work when the clutch is in?

Not sure... when I did it on my dd (no SRM) I sounded like a dogbox.

one blip to get it out of gear and another blip to get to the next gear. It was a rough shift. Lol. Not bad like a newb learning MT though.

cfweber · 05-16-2011, 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rone

I've had this car for almost two weeks now. It's the first M/T I've owned. I learned to drive a stick a few years ago from a good friend so I'm sure there are some things I still need to know.

Surprisingly, I've only stalled a hand full of times while getting used to it. What are some bad habits that you should try to avoid or break when driving a stick? I tried searching but didn't have any luck. Hopefully me and others on the forum can learn and have our cars last a little longer, lol.

Click Me!
Learn How to Drive a Manual Transmission

Augustus · 02-21-2012, 01:34 PM

Resurrecting an old thread but I thought that'd be better than starting another one. Curious on how you guys do a normal, flat-surface start in 1st. More vs. Less slip.

Had my Z for a month. My 2nd manual but the first one (WRX) I only had for a couple of years (bought new) to about 25k miles, so not long enough to understand long-term effects. Had a few bikes too, so clutches there but only about 10k total miles on them, not enough to know long-term.

Buddy at work has a daily-driver Cobalt but also a nice Mustang GT/CS that he drives on nice days. Both are manuals. I notice that when he drives, he uses a lot more revs & slip than I do to get going. Not a lot, perhaps 1,400-1,600 RPM for the 'stang, perhaps 2000-2200 for the Cobalt. Then clutch out smooth, but somewhat slowly -perhaps 2 or 3 seconds of slip - and go. Makes for a very smooth takeoff. A fast launch is more revs, but more or less the same amount of slippage. AFAIK, he's never had any clutch problems and he's had manuals for several years now.

I've got it in my head that I want the least RPM and least slippage I can get away with. So when I take off, I'm basically starting at idle (unless it's on a hill, then there's got to be gas). Just at the friction point I'm feathering the gas and coming off the clutch smoothly but quickly, perhaps 1-1.5 seconds for a normal, flat take-off. So by 1k RPM, I'm off the clutch and I'm applying gas to move. But in doing this sometimes I do get a bit of clutch chatter or rattle/clunk from the transmission when I let the RPM's fall too close to stalling. Though I have never stalled my Z. A fast launch would involve 2000-2500 RPM's and a very fast clutch release.

So, who's doing it right?

My buddy's method does result in smoother takeoffs, so I'm thinking his technique is superior. But I've got it in my head that slipping like that is a bad thing for the clutch. While I won't likely have this car past 50-60k miles, I would rather not wear out the clutch (or transmission) prematurely.

Do I need to chill out on 'saving' the clutch and purposefully get the revs up a bit more with a bit more slip, for the sake of smoothness? Or is the low-slip method better, but I just need to work on more finesse with the clutch/throttle to avoid chattering/clunking?

kenchan · 02-21-2012, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Augustus

Resurrecting an old thread but I thought that'd be better than starting another one. Curious on how you guys do a normal, flat-surface start in 1st. More vs. Less slip.

Had my Z for a month. My 2nd manual but the first one (WRX) I only had for a couple of years (bought new) to about 25k miles, so not long enough to understand long-term effects. Had a few bikes too, so clutches there but only about 10k total miles on them, not enough to know long-term.

Buddy at work has a daily-driver Cobalt but also a nice Mustang GT/CS that he drives on nice days. Both are manuals. I notice that when he drives, he uses a lot more revs & slip than I do to get going. Not a lot, perhaps 1,400-1,600 RPM for the 'stang, perhaps 2000-2200 for the Cobalt. Then clutch out smooth, but somewhat slowly -perhaps 2 or 3 seconds of slip - and go. Makes for a very smooth takeoff. A fast launch is more revs, but more or less the same amount of slippage. AFAIK, he's never had any clutch problems and he's had manuals for several years now.

I've got it in my head that I want the least RPM and least slippage I can get away with. So when I take off, I'm basically starting at idle (unless it's on a hill, then there's got to be gas). Just at the friction point I'm feathering the gas and coming off the clutch smoothly but quickly, perhaps 1-1.5 seconds for a normal, flat take-off. So by 1k RPM, I'm off the clutch and I'm applying gas to move. But in doing this sometimes I do get a bit of clutch chatter or rattle/clunk from the transmission when I let the RPM's fall too close to stalling. Though I have never stalled my Z. A fast launch would involve 2000-2500 RPM's and a very fast clutch release.

So, who's doing it right?

My buddy's method does result in smoother takeoffs, so I'm thinking his technique is superior. But I've got it in my head that slipping like that is a bad thing for the clutch. While I won't likely have this car past 50-60k miles, I would rather not wear out the clutch (or transmission) prematurely.

Do I need to chill out on 'saving' the clutch and purposefully get the revs up a bit more for the sake of smoothness? Or is the no-slip method better, but I just need to work on more finesse with the clutch/throttle to avoid chattering/clunking?

it's not a contest who can start the car at lower rpm. on the Z i rev considerably higher than my G and engagement duration is about a second longer. why? flywheel is lighter so it takes a tad longer to get the momentum going.

also check out the helper-spring mod. that might help your situation too as the clutch pedal feel is

on the Z until you remove/replace that spring.

GL!

Vaughanabe13 · 02-21-2012, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Augustus

Resurrecting an old thread but I thought that'd be better than starting another one. Curious on how you guys do a normal, flat-surface start in 1st. More vs. Less slip.

Had my Z for a month. My 2nd manual but the first one (WRX) I only had for a couple of years (bought new) to about 25k miles, so not long enough to understand long-term effects. Had a few bikes too, so clutches there but only about 10k total miles on them, not enough to know long-term.

Buddy at work has a daily-driver Cobalt but also a nice Mustang GT/CS that he drives on nice days. Both are manuals. I notice that when he drives, he uses a lot more revs & slip than I do to get going. Not a lot, perhaps 1,400-1,600 RPM for the 'stang, perhaps 2000-2200 for the Cobalt. Then clutch out smooth, but somewhat slowly -perhaps 2 or 3 seconds of slip - and go. Makes for a very smooth takeoff. A fast launch is more revs, but more or less the same amount of slippage. AFAIK, he's never had any clutch problems and he's had manuals for several years now.

I've got it in my head that I want the least RPM and least slippage I can get away with. So when I take off, I'm basically starting at idle (unless it's on a hill, then there's got to be gas). Just at the friction point I'm feathering the gas and coming off the clutch smoothly but quickly, perhaps 1-1.5 seconds for a normal, flat take-off. So by 1k RPM, I'm off the clutch and I'm applying gas to move. But in doing this sometimes I do get a bit of clutch chatter or rattle/clunk from the transmission when I let the RPM's fall too close to stalling. Though I have never stalled my Z. A fast launch would involve 2000-2500 RPM's and a very fast clutch release.

So, who's doing it right?

My buddy's method does result in smoother takeoffs, so I'm thinking his technique is superior. But I've got it in my head that slipping like that is a bad thing for the clutch. While I won't likely have this car past 50-60k miles, I would rather not wear out the clutch (or transmission) prematurely.

Do I need to chill out on 'saving' the clutch and purposefully get the revs up a bit more with a bit more slip, for the sake of smoothness? Or is the low-slip method better, but I just need to work on more finesse with the clutch/throttle to avoid chattering/clunking?

I have found (and read on here) that the Z doesn't have much low end torque, so you should really be giving it a little more gas on starts. 2K RPM is probably a good rough marker to shoot for. I also agree with the other poster about the clutch helper spring, it makes a HUGE difference in clutch feel and knowing when you hit the engagement point.

Augustus · 02-21-2012, 02:13 PM

Thanks for the good advice, guys.

No, I don't really treat it as a contest to see who can start at the lower RPM, I just want to drive my car correctly. Seems like I need to get rid of the "mustn't slip the clutch" mentality and give her a bit more gas on normal takeoffs.

Thanks!

Vaughanabe13 · 02-21-2012, 02:00 PM

While we're on the topic of MT, can someone answer this question for me. I feel dumb for asking...

In the movie "Back To The Future" there are several scenes where you see Marty in the DeLorean doing a fast takeoff. They show a shot of the pedals and what he does his release the clutch super fast and jam on the gas right after. I feel like that's not possible and the car would stall in real life. Is this just a movie magic thing or is really possible to get a fast start that way by whipping out the clutch and jamming on the gas like that?

05-15-2011, 12:30 PM	#5 (permalink)
djpathfinder A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Edmonton, Canada Posts: 12,910 Drives: 2012 GT-R BE Rep Power: 734	I've never tried the handbrake technique. The backwards roll on hill starts always seems to be a lot, but really, most of the time you've likely rolled less than 6-12 inches. __________________ 2012 GT-R Black Edition Jet Black 2010 370Z 40th Anniversary // SOLD

02-21-2012, 01:34 PM	#11 (permalink)
Augustus Base Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Illinois Posts: 146 Drives: 2011 370Z Touring M6 Rep Power: 14	resurrect.. Resurrecting an old thread but I thought that'd be better than starting another one. Curious on how you guys do a normal, flat-surface start in 1st. More vs. Less slip. Had my Z for a month. My 2nd manual but the first one (WRX) I only had for a couple of years (bought new) to about 25k miles, so not long enough to understand long-term effects. Had a few bikes too, so clutches there but only about 10k total miles on them, not enough to know long-term. Buddy at work has a daily-driver Cobalt but also a nice Mustang GT/CS that he drives on nice days. Both are manuals. I notice that when he drives, he uses a lot more revs & slip than I do to get going. Not a lot, perhaps 1,400-1,600 RPM for the 'stang, perhaps 2000-2200 for the Cobalt. Then clutch out smooth, but somewhat slowly -perhaps 2 or 3 seconds of slip - and go. Makes for a very smooth takeoff. A fast launch is more revs, but more or less the same amount of slippage. AFAIK, he's never had any clutch problems and he's had manuals for several years now. I've got it in my head that I want the least RPM and least slippage I can get away with. So when I take off, I'm basically starting at idle (unless it's on a hill, then there's got to be gas). Just at the friction point I'm feathering the gas and coming off the clutch smoothly but quickly, perhaps 1-1.5 seconds for a normal, flat take-off. So by 1k RPM, I'm off the clutch and I'm applying gas to move. But in doing this sometimes I do get a bit of clutch chatter or rattle/clunk from the transmission when I let the RPM's fall too close to stalling. Though I have never stalled my Z. A fast launch would involve 2000-2500 RPM's and a very fast clutch release. So, who's doing it right? My buddy's method does result in smoother takeoffs, so I'm thinking his technique is superior. But I've got it in my head that slipping like that is a bad thing for the clutch. While I won't likely have this car past 50-60k miles, I would rather not wear out the clutch (or transmission) prematurely. Do I need to chill out on 'saving' the clutch and purposefully get the revs up a bit more with a bit more slip, for the sake of smoothness? Or is the low-slip method better, but I just need to work on more finesse with the clutch/throttle to avoid chattering/clunking? Last edited by Augustus; 02-21-2012 at 01:38 PM.

02-21-2012, 02:00 PM	#15 (permalink)
Vaughanabe13 Enthusiast Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Iowa Posts: 387 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z M6 Rep Power: 15	While we're on the topic of MT, can someone answer this question for me. I feel dumb for asking... In the movie "Back To The Future" there are several scenes where you see Marty in the DeLorean doing a fast takeoff. They show a shot of the pedals and what he does his release the clutch super fast and jam on the gas right after. I feel like that's not possible and the car would stall in real life. Is this just a movie magic thing or is really possible to get a fast start that way by whipping out the clutch and jamming on the gas like that? __________________ 2009 Nissan 370Z Touring, w/sport, 6MT, chicane yellow/black.

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05-16-2011, 09:49 AM	#7 (permalink)
shadoquad A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: . Posts: 42,608 Drives: . Rep Power: 3887	I don't mind wasting the gas to coast in neutral. I do it all the time, but generally when I do, I'm ready to react, foot hovering on clutch and brake.

05-16-2011, 06:50 PM	#8 (permalink)
Red__Zed A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: window seat Posts: 28,940 Drives: Mostly on two wheels Rep Power: 121	Doesn't synchro rev only work when the clutch is in?

02-21-2012, 02:13 PM	#14 (permalink)
Augustus Base Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Illinois Posts: 146 Drives: 2011 370Z Touring M6 Rep Power: 14	Thanks for the good advice, guys. No, I don't really treat it as a contest to see who can start at the lower RPM, I just want to drive my car correctly. Seems like I need to get rid of the "mustn't slip the clutch" mentality and give her a bit more gas on normal takeoffs. Thanks!