Increased Valve Noise After Change To Amsoil
 

Just yesterday morning (Saturday), I changed the oil of my 2009 370Z using the Amsoil top of the line Signature Series oil. The weight is 0w30 which is what Amsoil recommends for this engine. The car has 7800 miles on it. I drove it around for a short time and everything seemed fine.

Well, today I got up early and drove 32 miles to an excellent twisty road that's about 8 miles long and a favorite of motorcyclists. After doing one pass where the car is kept mostly in 3rd gear and the rpm's stay in the 4 to 5k range, I pulled over and popped the hood and noticed a louder than usual valve clicking noise. I then stepped back next to the drivers doors and the clicking was even louder and seemed to be also coming from under the car.

I then did another pass on this twisty road and headed home. When I got home the car sounded normal and a couple of hours later I started the car and everything seemed fine.

I know the Amsoil is a very thin oil, but it's supposed to offer superb protection against wear at any speed.

I like to drive like this every now and then and I wonder if I should add a viscosity increasing additive such as STP? My thought is the Amsoil is a bit too thin for this type of driving in this particular engine.

I am no expert, but IMO you should be fine with the oil you have now. I would personally not use any additives to the oil. If you are concerned with the valve noise you might use 5W30 on your next oil change. I am sure you will get plenty of comments to make your decision. Good luck! :tup:

This thread should get interesting.

:iagree:

5w30 Amsoil
 

I have been using 5w30 Amsoil XL (7,500 mile oil) since the first oil change (3,500 miles). I could tell a slight increase in valvetrain clicking at first, but two oil changes later the noise is subdued. I have been impressed w/ the oil. Low consumption (1/2 quart added over 7,000 miles) and the oil always looked clean (golden brown). Oil temps range from 207 to 220 in 95+ heat (spurts of hard acceleration-220). I would not worry about the valvetrain. This is a very good oil.

Are those temps with an oil cooler installed?

The G37 suffered from valve train noise and the solution was a software upgrade and using the Nissan ester oil. Road and Track was using Nissan ester in their long term
370Z and then switched to a conventional 5W-30 to see what would happen to the noise level. Valve train noise went up with the conventional oil. General consensus is that the increased valve train noise will not harm the engine.

That may be true but once I put Royal Purple in my engine and my dog died the very next day! :mad: I'm just sayin....... :(

I did Mobil1 today and no noise... No change from original oil


I think just use normal oil if you don't want complications.

:icon18:

No oil cooler. I don't intend to track it and don't want the worry of a hose/cooler failure. The high oil temp issue seems to be related to green engines and high ambient temps. Mine is thoroughly broken in and I grab the highest possible gear after hard acceleration. No need to just rev the engine w/ its flat torque curve.

My guess is the reflash just smoothed the transitions between various valve settings so make it run a little more quietly and the rest was the Este roil.

That last part is good to know, but who arrived at that conclusion -- R&T?

To the OP, as an experiment, you might try either the Nissan Ester oil or another band (e.g. Redline) on your next oil change and see if the valve ticking subsides.

Kinda curious to see what happens when I switch to the 0-W30 Castrol...

Anyone have any proof that valvetrain clicking loudness is associated with any problems? I thought not. Sometimes we focus on the sounds our engines make a bit too much. Enjoy your car. You're using acceptable oil.

What is the cSt of the oil at 40 and 100* Celcius. Just because it is 0-30 instead of 5-30 does NOT mean it is thinner.

That is very true about viscosity. I believe the OP was referring to the webpage on their recommendation for the 0W30. You should always choose the oil best for your local temps and driving habits. 0W30 in California this time a year might be to thin? They also list two different types of 5W30 you can use. Here are the properties for each oil:

Every oil for our 370Z
AMSOIL Product Recommendations - 2010%7cNISSAN%2fDATSUN%7c370Z%7cM

Signature Series 0W-30 100% Synthetic Motor Oil
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/sso.aspx

SAE 5W-30 100% Synthetic Motor Oil
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/asl.aspx

Extended Life 5W-30 Synthetic Motor Oil (XLF)
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/xlf.aspx]AMSOIL

I run 0-30GermanCastrol in every car I have owned (except a 5.0 with a built (H/C/carb-conversion) engine with trouble that I never diagnosed (compression even, etc.), which DRANK oil, I ran 15-40 Rotella T in that. Horrible.)

In my LS1, it cut consumption vs. 5-30 Mobil one from 1qt/2500mi to 3/4qt 4500mi.

0-30GC is thicker than any 5/30 out there that I am aware of other than the other true group IV's like AMsoil and Redline, which I am not familiar with their ratings as I have not used them.

Was there any increase in altitude associated with this road?

Boy, you don't give people a lot of time to answer, do you.

My experience was I had some valvetrain click in my engine and my dog died the very next day! :(

What was your dog doing in the engine :confused:

:icon18:

Dog power + Horse power = DogHorse Power! Duh! :rolleyes:

No the road is sea level. The road is twisty, but not a twisty mountain road.

Good point. I intend to continue using AMSOIL, but I will try a different viscosity for my next change.

I was thinking of trying the European spec oil they offer, but I wonder if this engine can tolerate a 5w40 oil?

Your engine was already at operating temperature and therefor at a higher viscosity than 0. Why not have Blackstone do a oil analysis for you? I would not increase oil viscosity past Nissan's recommendation.

so thats how you can get rid of the things.

0/w30....5/w30.....10/w30.....
there seems to be more oil choices then z's on the road...
regular or synthetic......

i'm betting you could run wal-mart super tech "which no one ever will"
change it every 3000 miles and it wouldn't make a difference.

that statement i know is over kill. but so is the topic of oil.
what to use,when to change it, how much is my engine burning if any.

ok i'm off my soapbox.sorry to ramble

I grind up some miata doors to micro levels and add them to my oil so that they can strengthen my valves. 5w30M

I wouldn’t take that bet because you're right! Old school, but good school and still followed to the tee by many a mechanic on their own vehicles with basic dino.

That "0" and that "30" are very misleading and pointless, imho. Forget they are on the bottle and go with cSt ratings and you will have a better handle on things.

You would have me belive that oil gets thicker as it gets hotter.

I would have you belive that if you send me $50,000, I will sell you my bridge in NY.

I think the ad-pack is as, or more important than the base-stock in many cases. You need good base-stock, but the ad-pack is what makes many oils good for what they are good for (Shell Rotella T for flat tappet, etc. etc.)

This is my understanding of engine oil weights. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Regular oil: for example, 5w-30...is a 5 weight oil that thickens to a 30 weight when it gets hot.

Synthetic oil: for example, 0w-40...is a 40 weight oil that flows like a 0 weight oil when it's cold.

Well I couldn't help myself and I just had to know, so I poured in a 12oz bottle of STP oil treatment. I know it's sacrilege, but I figured the small amount of STP wouldn't significantly affect the overall performance of the more than 5 qts of AMSOIL in the engine.

I then drove the same road under the same conditions and guess what? The increased clicking was eliminated. When I popped the hood the engine sounded the same as it normally does.

I intend to run the AMSOIL for 15k miles and change it again, but with a difference. I'll put in 3 qts of the 0w30 and 2 qts of their 5w40 Euro spec oil.

Hopefully, this will give me the same results as adding the STP, but with the benefit of 100% synthetic oil.

I think most would agree that 15,000 miles is too long an interval between oil changes especially for a car under warranty. At a minimum you need to follow what the owner's manual recommends.

No.

Oil doesn't thicken when it gets hot.

Do what I said and disregard those BIG numbers and flip the bottle around or get online and look up the numbers as "cSt at 40*C and cSt at 100*C" and you will get a MUCH more accurate picture of the viscosity of your oil at cranking and operating temps.

Why are you doing this? Now you have an oil much thicker than Nissan spec'ed for the car.

A lot of people just don't understand oil, viscosity, etc. and have been brainwashed by those big numbers on the front of the bottle that don't mean a damn thing about viscosity of that oil slinging around in an engine.

This is your Amsoil 0-30's viscosity:
Kinematic Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt (ASTM D445) 10.3
Kinematic Viscosity @ 40°C, cSt (ASTM D445) 56.56
AMSOIL - Signature Series 0W-30 100% Synthetic Motor Oil (SSO)

This is your Amsoil 5-40's viscosity:
Kinematic Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 13.7
Kinematic Viscosity @ 40°C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 79.7
AMSOIL - European 100% Synthetic 5W-40 Motor Oil (AFL)

This is the Nissan Ester Oil that is so highly recommended by Nissan:
MyG37 - View Single Post - Blackstone Laboratories Oil Analysis Reports

I could not find industry spec on this oil, so I found a sample with 2K miles on it sent to Blackstone Labs. The cSt at 100*C was only 8.19. So either Nissan's Ester oil (which is just conventional base-stock with an Ester addative--nowhere near as good as your Amsoil) is VERY VERY thin, or it shears down VERY VERY FAST, but considering that at 5K miles you can see that his sample sent in was 8.38, I don't think it is having an issue with shearing. IT appears to have thickened up a bit, for what reason I do not have an answer, but that is not completely uncommon.

Either way, you took a 10.3cSt oil and added a 13.7 cSt oil. When an 8.X cSt oil was spec'ed

WHY!?

For my Z (now at 9800+ miles):

Factory fill - no valvetrain clicking
Amsoil 5w30 - no valvetrain clicking
Pennzoil Ultra 5w30 - no valvetrain clicking

Disclaimer: No dogs were harmed during the above oil changes.

:)

Based on your experience it looks like I should go for the AMSOIL 5w30 at my next oil change. And that's what I will do.

I wonder just how much the STP changed the specs on the 0w30 AMSOIL.
I guess I'll change it after 5000 miles to the 5w30 AMSOIL that some others are having good experience with.

Sounds like a plan. If you want something a TOUCH thicker than the 0-30 Amsoil at operating temp, try the 0-30 German Castrol. It is a true group IV synthetic and runs around $6qt at Autozone (only place you can buy it).

Update!
 

I need to amend what I previously wrote. Just got back from a 1,300 mile flog on the interstate (@100 degrees-80/85 mph) and aggressive driving through tight mountain roads (elevation changes). Temps got up to 225-230 on that 100 degree interstate drive. Cooled considerably on the Blue Ridge Parkway (185-195, 63-74 temps). Did notice that the oilt temps would drop when engine braking/coasting even w/ the engine turning 3,800-4,000 rpm. Also found that going uphill in 4th (@2,400rpm) following slow traffic that the temps rose to 240. Downshifted to 3rd thinking that I was putting too much load on it at too low rpm and the temps remained the same; weird. Must be dependent on torque requirements. Those 240 degree temps had me contemplating a cooler, but I don't have conditions like that where I live (mostly flat). The engine performed flawlessly through this whole drive. Glad I had a quality synthetic in the sump!