New guy, moving from an S4 to 370z?
 

Hey,

I currently have a B6 S4 ('04) with slight mods (exhaust, ECU, etc) but I find reliability and costs a bit much for my tastes for that car. I'm wondering if a new 370z would be a better platform for me.

Ideally I was going to invest ~7.5K of performance mods in the S4, but after about 2k in performance mods I've paid twice that in maintenance and other issues. Overall, the car is really pricey to keep running. And, I'm having no luck finding a solid aftermarket warranty for it. Also, I have some electrical gremlins that 3x mechanics are unable to solve.

In '05 I bought an STi '04 and I loved it. Tuned it lightly to "stage 2", about 320whp dyno'd. Great car.

I'm wondering if the Z would be a solid platform for tuning. I havent' done a ton of research yet, so if you can point me to solid threads or urls, I'm more than happy to read them.

Some of the first things I'm looking for is the typical failure list and shopping list when buying a new Z. I'm also concerned with best bang for buck performance mods.

I saw this thread: http://www.the370z.com/nissan-370z-g...-question.html but it doesn't list the information I want to know ; typical failures, recalls, best tuning shops/on-line resources, etc.

I'm also looking at a new STi, but I'd like to try a Nissan as a GT-R is my longer term goal and this is as close as I can get for now, heh.

My other question is: Better to go w/the base model and tune it, or get the best model I can afford from the factory?

TIA.

Welcome,
I'll try to help as best I can. There's not much concern for failures or recalls at this point. A very small number of Z's have oil consumption issues. Also, there are issues with oil temps. If you spend much time on the track or are in a hot environment look into an oil cooler. They are only about $600 on the high end.

Where tuning is concerned you have a lot of options with varying results. You can stick to an NA build for minimal cost without adding any reliability issues. Typical mods are Cold air intake, high flow cats, test pipes or long tube headers, and a cat back exhaust. Generally speaking the first of those mods will net you ~15hp and additional mods will net an additional 6hp each. An uprev tune will help you get the most out of it but all told you're probably looking at a gain of 30hp to the wheels.

The second option is go FI where you have several options. On paper I like the offerings from GTM which includes both stage 1 and 2 Twin Turbos or Supercharger. These require a few supporting mods and can be really expensive. They can also put you in the 500hp / 400tq range. Reliability with these has yet to be determined. There just isn't enough information from long term use.

There are also many exterior, suspension, brake, and wheel options to look into.

Hey buddahson,

Thanks for all the feedback. So the NA route you can get roughly 30whp for what, I'm guessing those mods are about 5k?

The FI route, that's a thought. As this isn't my DD (NYC), I could go that route, I guess reliability and cost (and finding a good tuner in the NY area) would be major issues. Also, I'm assuming FI would totally render the warranty void.

My next question/thought is about the 40k 370z on the Nissan website, listed at 350hp with the 19" rims and all sorts of performance goodies. For about 7K over the base model, that seems like a really good deal (350hp, 19" rims, body styling, brakes, etc).

If I get a base model at 33k and put another 5k at 38k, I still don't have rims or upgraded brakes, etc, etc.

Thoughts?

If you are thinking about the Nismo and modding, it's probably only worth it if you like the styling significantly more than the base model. The base plus sport comes with 19" (although slightly smaller in width), upgraded brakes, upgraded diff, etc. With full bolts ons and tune you will be well over 350 hp even on a base. You should go test drive one and see if you like it.

Hey ClemsonWill,

I'm heading over there tonight. I'm not sure if they have a Nismo though, they seemed to only have base model when I called.

Good points. Thanks.

Definitely let us know how you like it. Hopefully they have at least a sport for you to drive.

dont get a nismo, they suck! :stirthepot:

I don't think they have a sport either. That is what I originally requested. I think just base model (for the time being). Will be nice to drive one either way.

Heh, ok. One thing that does "suck" is that you don't get to control the tuning process as much if you go into the Nismo. Tuning to me, and the originality, is probably one of the best things about tuning cars. For sure, unless I happen to fall in love w/the Nismo, I wouldn't get it. The styling is OK, but it's not how I invision my 370z.

The Nismo does have a nice HP jump though over base and the rims and brakes are nice.

heheh. I want to drive on though!

So ...

After a bunch of back and forth emails, I show up and they have no Zs. They said they can't get them. Ha...so like why not tell me that over the phone. They said they had base models, but what they MEANT to say was, they can order me a base model.

Well, I'm not buying a car I can't at least drive. So, I'll have to look in the NY area for a forum member that wouldn't mind letting me have a ride in their Z.

Anways, I chatted with them for a bit. They can possibly order me a white or black manual transmission base model. No way to get the Sport or anything else.

They said, any aftermarket tuning will void the warranty - unless I get Nismo items and have them install it.

Overall, to be, this sounds like the wrong platform for me to be tuning. Why am I going to pay 35K for a car, dump a bunch of money into it only to lose my warranty...doesn't make sense.

Though, they said I can get rims. haha. Thanks guys.
So, overall, pretty shitty experience at the Nissan dealer.

They also tried the get it now before it's too late we can't find another Z tactic...

S4 is a great car, my friend has on 07, loooots of work done to it, and another friend who has a '10 rs4.

The Z is different. My friend with the S4 loves being in my car, we went to an audi meet in Baldwin one nite, and everyone was looking at my car, not my friends cars.

Back to your original question though. I'd easily recommend the Sport package. Base or Touring is up to you if you care about the other ammenities, but the Sport is easily worth the cash to me. I don't think the Nismo is worth it though.

As for mods, I agree with everyone else pretty much, NA, cold air intake, long tube headers or high flow cats, an exhaust, and a tune and you'd be good. for suspension, sways and either springs or coils, other mods depend on what you really want/need.

As for a tuner, Performance Motorsports, which if you look in the North East section on the forum, you'll see they are one of the top tuners in the country, there is also VinnyTen Racing.

Dealers, Koepel Nissan in Queens is/used to be a forum sponsor, you might want to search for them on the forum, or stop by there, i dont remember off the top of my head who you'd want to speak with.

Good Luck!

Hey Justin,

Thanks for the feedback. Yeah S4 is great, and I'd love a new one, but at like 50k+ ... I can't see the sense in breaking the 50k wall for a car. At this point in my life, even if I could/can swing it. Anyways...

Yeah the mod list looks pretty good. I think I'm down with all of those.

The real question I have is, how are people handling warranties w/those mods? Judging by what the dealer said in Brooklyn, I don't see how anyone can mod a damn thing and still retain a warranty.

I just reached out to Koepel Nissan, thanks.

I'm going to continue searching around, thanks.

Mr. sk,

That is very ironic that the first time I search for a 370z forum because I am considering buyng one, I find this. I too have a B6 S4 2004. I can agree with you 100% that it is a very pricey car to maintain, that is the main reason I want to dump mine. Not to mention the gas milage is horrendous.

I had a 350z before my S4, and it was an awesome car. I had all performance mods done to it, coil overs, intake, header, DPs, CB exhaust, upgraded plenum, UD pulley, 19" rays Nismos 5 spokes, and at the very end of it's life, 100 shot of nitrous. I would have to say, if the 350z was as good as it was, coming from an s4 to the upgrade version of it, it would be a good move. Maintenance was minimal compared to the S4. 60 per year for oil changes, and that's about it, compared to the S4s $120 10 quart oil changes 3 times a year.

My 350z kicked ***, that's why I am going back to the 370z.

P.S. - the only reason why I don't have the 350z is because someone hit me and totaled the car. RIP.

P.S.S. - I have been on car forums for every car that I have owned, and the people that belong to AudiZine all seem to be dickheads. My350z and this forum seem to be very humble, this thread is a good example.

Hey johnny_domino,

Small world man. Yeah I'm on AudiZine a lot and, maybe it's because the B6 has been around for while people get sick of hearing/reading the same questions over and over, or whatever the reason is, but yeah there is an undercurrent of outright rudeness on Audizine, which is a shame, because there are a number of awesome people as well on there.

When I used to own my STi, the iwsti forums were/are a great place. That's another pretty solid forum.

Anways, bummed to hear about your prior 350z ... better luck w/the new 370z. Your 350z sounded MEAN!

I mean, sure, maybe the 370 won't have the same subtle touches the B6 has in craftsmanship (Audi's do have some of the nicest interiors, IMO), but I don't care all that much. I just want something that looks cool (The 370 looks cool to me) and is a blast to drive, reliable, and a good tuning platform.

My big unknown is the entire warranty / moding conflict. I've still got to get a better understanding of if I have wiggle room on this or not.

Yeah, gas is awful on the V8 - I've got an APR tune, which made my has mileage even worse! heh.

PS: I also went ahead and reached out to VinnyTen to get an idea on mods and warranty. Hopefully (being not to far from me in NY) then can shed some light and if I end up getting a Z, I'll need a tuner...so might as well start the search now, heh.

Thanks for the feedback man, good luck on your Z search!

Modding your 370Z will not void crap. Replacing the exhaust doesn't void anything. I believe even replacing the cats doesn't void the warranty. Plus, Magnusson-Moss act says that dealer has to prove that failure of the car was performed by the mods. It's only if you touch the motor or transmission, like turbo it, supercharge it, cams, clutch, flywheel, pulleys, etc. that you run a huge risk of warranty issues if the issue is mechanical.

Otherwise, general bolt-ons and a tune won't give you any troubles. You can easily gain 30-40WHP with just bolt ons, and no it won't cost you anywhere near $5K - more like ~$2K. $1000 for exhaust . $200-500 for cat delete (depending on test pipes, HFCs, or ART Pipes), $500 for complete dyno tune, and about $150-450 for intakes (which are worthless on our cars, IMO).

/\ your fear about warrantee issues, while def a valid one, is something that really will/can vary from dealership to dealership. I've got no issues at my dealership in FL that I go to and I've cultivated a very "cozy" relationship with the GM, mechanic, even got to know the owner a bit etc.

Just to give you an idea as far as modding potential, I baseline dynoed stock at 296 whp. After installing the long tube headers and exhaust (no tune or anything else) and redynoed a month or two later and got 326 whp. So +30 whp with full exhaust mods from the block back and total cost for parts was around $2900ish. I've since added drop ins and a tune but haven't had a chance to go redyno at the same place I always go (like to use the same dyno so the comparos are more valid).

I think the 370z is a very fun car with decent potential for mods and won't break the bank doing them either. It gets decent gas mileage and looks great.

Btw, if you're looking for another dealership, go to Legend Nissan. Easily the best Nissan dealership you can ask for. They are an absolute pleasure - speak to Glen Christian (sales manager) and you'll never look back.

Performance motorsports in Smithtown is owned by same people as the dealership across the street.. Smithtown Nissan... Its a performance shop and they are great with tuning the Zs and installing whatever parts you may want/need...

There is also no way you can't get a base/sport right now...

I have a ton of mods and still get things warrantied as needed.... Check out another dealer!

@FL_4Motion:

I was hoping that is the case. I'm going to bail on the dealer, though about 10m away from my house, which is convenient, doesn't matter since I won't buy from them.

326whp sounds great with bolt-ons for ~3k. I'd be very happy with those sorts of gains for the price. Thanks for the feedback.

@Arnold K.:

Cool - they are < 40m away from me. I will check them out.

@Chuckd05:

Awesome. They are a bit further from me, >60m but not bad. It's great the tuner is across the street, heh.

I guess they just don't want my money *that* bad ... I do like the sport's rims and for the cost seems like a great starting point for the price.

Thanks again to everyone's feedback thus far.

This weekend I'm hiking in Vermont, but next weekend I'm going to stack a visit to both Legend and Smithtown on a Saturday.


Any chance Arnold K. or Chuckd05 are going to be in the NY/Brooklyn area in the next week or so? I'd love to check out your cars ...

Thanks again guys for all the feedback. At least finding a solid Z community wasn't as difficult as finding a dealer. heh.

I don't go to Brooklyn. But you can come to our weekly Wednesday meet in Great Neck. Check out the North East section for details.

Right on. I found it and it's not too far away, so I'll be there on Wed (aug 3) unless something comes up or the weather is crap (I'm assuming that kills the turnout).

I just spoke to Brandon over at Vinnys (Nice guy BTW) and he recommended I get in touch with Westbury Nissan ... I'll be giving them a call shortly.

mr_sk, good luck with everything, you'll see this community is great.

@Justin1686 - Thanks man - the experience on the forum has be awesome so far.

So, I got off the one w/Sully over at Westbury Nissan. Quality dood - basically he said they are "pro tuners" and in fact a few of the doods that work there tune as well and it'd be no problem w/the bolt-on mods.

So, that's a win. Also, they have a black sport manual in stock ... I'm gone this weekend but I'll be going out there early next week to check it out. I'm thinking Thursday, since Wed I'll be at the meet to see some of the forum's Zs.

So I gotta do some research now to see what the price points are for that car, etc etc. I also need to list my B6 and see what sorta loot I can get for it ....

Thanks for all the feeback thus far ...

Regarding price: aim for invoice. Check out AutoTrader.com to see what the invoice of that 370Z is with that package. Aim at that price - maybe an extra $100 or $200

For some reason, Autotrader doesn't have the sport listed, they just have base model, touring and nismo. I'm guessing the cost for the sport would be between base and touring:

Base:
$31,450 MSRP
$29,464 Invoice

Touring:
$36,150 starting MSRP
$33,483 starting Invoice

I'll continue to look around ...

glws on ur s4.

Sport is a package. You have to select it for either Base or Touring.

@ Justin1686: Thanks, just listed over at the Audi forums. We'll see ...

@ Arnold K.: Was thinking that myself, but thank you for the clarification. TMV is listed at $30,421 at Edmunds, and Nissan lists the sport package for ~$3000 over the base price, which would put a sport around 33,500 from the dealer (for a good deal)?

I guess that makes sense because the dealer was asking 35,xxx for the Sport. If I can get the price to 33.5K is that a good deal?

Yeah, invoice is 32.9K. 33.5 is good. 35K is MSRP.

So, I went over to Advantage/Westbury Nissan tonight to take a look at a black sport, do a test drive and talk #s.

Overall, very cool guys over there.

So, 1st impressions on the test drive.......not as fast/quick as I thought it would be. It felt slower in 2/3 than my S4 and didn't seem to have the punch my STI does off the line...that could have been me just not *really* pushing the car and the fact I've been driving an AT the last 10 months and my clutch skills are subpar...the car rev'd high, but I didn't feel any real "power" behind it...just my initial thoughts...

Second, its damn small inside. Like, no room for skis, paintball equipment, or even my dog. That's a serious bummer for me.I thought it at least had a trunk.

Otherwise, loved the car, the styling and feel on the road. Price was good and they offered me an actually decent trade on my S4 (still pending formal appraisal).

So, my questions to you guys:

1) How do you combat the storage issue? What do you guys do in the winter? I don't want to have two cars, but ****, this thing has no room.

2) Speed. I see figures for a ~4.7 0-60, where my S4 is considerably slower at ~5.6 .. and 04 STI is stated 4.5, (I was stage 2) and that's quoted around 4.1 but I can't recall.

With both the STI and the S4 I "felt" the acceleration/torque so much more. Is it just me that thinks the Z feels a little slow compared to the vehicles I mentioned.

3) I've never owned a rear wheel drive car, how can I expect the winter to be driving in it? My last two cars (S4, STi) are AWD.

Well, I'm not trying to sound like a downer, I did enjoy driving the car, it just raised some additional questions.

Thanks again for all the feedback so far ... and I'll see you guys tomorrow night.

can't really answer any of the other questions, but as to your question about "feeling" the acceleration, well thats mostly because the Z "builds" up power through the RPM's is the best way i can put it whereas cars like the S4 and STI deliver the torque at lower RPM's and then taper off at the higher RPM's where the Z will still keep pulling due to the mostly flat torque curve on the Z.

@Z_ealot: Word, makes sense ... and I wasn't really driving the car that hard so I didn't experience the continued high rpm acceleration.

I'm doing research now into trunk space and snow driving. It seems the trunk is not as small as it seemed at the dealer - people have been able to fit a decent amount of stuff in it.

I'm seeing threads about not really using the Z for snow driving ... without a proper setup: http://www.the370z.com/nissan-370z-g...-z-winter.html

Not sure if this is the best car for me.... = [
I would really like more space and winter capabilities.

I would imagine most people looking at a 370Z should know it's RWD with very little storage space.

@Arnold K: hah, yeah yeah. I've just never seen one in person. My criteria for a new car is fast, tunable, local support (mechanic/dealer), warranty.

My considerations are: STi (dont like the new body style), EVO (no local mitsu dealers, plus not sure about mitso as company), A4 (Stasis is expensive for my closest Audi dealer to retain warranty, don't really like A* models, can't afford new S* models), R32 VW (still a possible consideration), which brought me to the Z, because it had all the items I cared about.

I hadn't really thought much about winter and size until I saw the Z yesterday and I had both thoughts. My girl is saying I'm having a midlife crisis buying a sports car ... hah.

Arnold, you going to the meet-up tonight? I'm trying to get outta work on-time so I can shoot over around 8/8:30.

I guess I'll just touch on the mods side, As far as CEB, and Cold air intake and tune will net you right around 300WHP( See sig), Cost for me was pretty low, The CBE would cost $1000( Mine was way less test fit car), Cold air intake was $375 and tune was $500 so what $1875 so for under 2k you will change the way the car drives and have tons of fun :).. Warranty issues will only come up if you have a tune and a ECU issue, But the UPREV you can switch back to a "Stock" Map if you are going to the dealer for that type of issue. Overall these engines are pretty well made and should have no issue, Yes there are a few but nothing to worry about.

As far as what model get a in between, My car is loaded NO NAV, Honest do not need it ( Smart phones FTW) But have leather and heated seats and Roof( I have a G37). But get the Z and be happy. If worried about the winter get my car G37X Coupe. :)

Def the Z is small on the inside (5' 10", 290lbs here but i fit), but the hatch can hold a decent amount of stuff. As far as winter driving, can't comment first hand, but there are some crazy canuks out there that slap winter tires on them and drive the Z year round. Personally, I like having the Z and our other car, nissan Xterra, give the best of both worlds. If you are really into doing outdoorsy stuff, mountain biking, surfing, snow boarding etc, then honestly, the Z as a sole car doesn't make the most sense. Still hope you pick one up tho, there a great car. Maybe you could get a fwd beater to go with it at some point so your hauling/snow issue would be resolved.

The new Golf R (r32 replacement) comes out soon, it's awd and 260hp turbo, not a sports car, but sporty and practical and around 30-35K. I hate to even bring up another car, but I just don't want to see another thread where someone is selling their Z 1-3 months after purchase cause it's bad in the winter or is only a 2 seater...

Tires are more important than your drivetrain in winter driving. Get some dedicated winter tires and you'll be fine. You will have to worry more about clearance in the deep stuff more than you will traction.

@ ANMVQ: Word man. Sounds pretty good price/power wise. I've seen the uprev mentioned, not sure what it is, will have to do some searching. Model wise, I'm going for sport if/when I pull the trigger. Thanks man.

@FL 4Motion: Yeah, I don't do a ton of winter driving, and I'm sure with good tires and 100lbs of sand in the hatch, I'll be OK. The Z isn't my daily driver, NYC public transit is, heh. Golf R would be cool, but I really dig the styling and community behind the Z. Not to mention I've found both a cool dealer (Advantage) and tuner (Vinnys) ... though I've not bought the car OR had work done, just spoke to them.

Of course. I do appreciate the feedback. Just trying to make the decision, thinking about the times we're I've had > 2 people in my car, or lots of gear. Trying to decide if a few minor sacrifices on size and such will bother me in the long run.

@ MuSH: . Coo- you probably right. I'll have to do some research and see what the best results people have been getting in the Z for snow tires.

@ ANMVQ: Word man. Sounds pretty good price/power wise. I've seen the uprev mentioned, not sure what it is, will have to do some searching. Model wise, I'm going for sport if/when I pull the trigger. Thanks man.

No problem man, Just read you test drive post also,, Remember you are now driving a NA car, Feels completely different the power is more linear and not a kick in the face, LOL, ( Coming from a 11 sec EVO) .. .. The power delivery is different. All tho you will feel a small kick above 3k VVEL kicks,, when you get the UPREV tune this is more noticeable by a lot.. Seriously if you are worried about room for ski's and paint ball stuff, look at the G coupe, The back seat folds down and I get both my golf bags and other misc stuff in there no sweat..

Uprev is FTW.

heh, yeah you are right. It doesn't have that "kick". Ok, looking at the infiniti's now. Never really considered them - they are very popular here in NY though.

I also found this: Boofsquire Roof Racks Pretty f'n cool for carrying skis.