Takeda intakes and Scangauge info

[JB1]

I bought a set of Takeda intakes because they were affordable and easy to install. But after seeing The Dreamers dyno results I felt like they are a waste of money. It looks like the Takedas make the engine run rich and therefore do not make the promised performance gains. Most likely due to the fact that they get the intake air form within the hot engine bay.

I installed the intakes last month, but besides the nice sound I can't really detect any performance gains. (this based on my un-calibrated butt dyno, even though this "dyno" did feel the gains from my Berk HFC's installed 2 months ago)

To take a more scientific and educated approach to this whole modification process I decided to get a Scangauge. Mainly to measure air intake temps, as these seem to have a big effect on the performance of the intake system.

So, I figured, I might as well share my "results" here to see what you guys have to say about the effectiveness of these intakes.

Well, with the Takeda intakes I have been steadily running Intake Air Temps of about 20 to 25 degrees over ambient in the past 2 weeks. Note, this only at 45 MPH or more. If the speed is below 45 MPH (in town or stop and go trafic) IAT's quickly go up to about 140/150. (oil temp is stable at about 200/210). Ambient temps have been between 65 to 40 degrees here in the Chicago area.

Yesterday I noticed that I can also read A/F ratios with the Scangauge. In the past 2 days of commuter traffic, the A/F ratios hover around 13.5 to 14.5. This looks to be quite good to me but the Long term Fuel trims are at -4, so this would indicate a correction for running a bit rich.

AIT's look high to me as well, but A/F and LFT look OK to me. So based on these last two values there is no reason for bad performance from the Takeda's

Ignition timing as indicated by the scangauge shifts between 53 to -7. The -7 value only appears at cold start (during the "Cat light off" or "Cat warm up"). Other then that the values are always " + ". (experts, please correct me if i'm wrong).

So, as I by no means am an expert in interpreting these figures, I wonder what you guys have to say...

[theDreamer]

Thanks for the info JB1, I do wonder if with proper heatshields these start to show much better results. I know with Amplifieds 370z Takeda showed gains of around 7HP on a dyno jet so maybe there is hope.

[M.J.]

That's great info. I've had my Takedas in a box for a month and a half trying to decide what I was going to do. I can live with a 4hp increase but really didn't like the idea of the car running rich all the time. I went ahead and did the install today and love the sound (I'm easily amused). Did a battery disconnect for a reset and we'll see what happens. Maybe I'll work on some way to shield the intakes from underhood heat. But yeah. Your scangauge info is very interesting. Big thank you.

[KillBill]

When we start with the bolt ons with this engine, there is no getting around a Technosquare reflash...There has been articles on it in Import Tuner and I forget where else. Once you get your reflash after some bolt ons...you will feel the difference

[tbss370z]

I installed the intake a few months ago and did get the same negative results on the dyno like several people here have noted. I ordered some universal aluminium heat shields and noticed lowered oil temps. I have not tested it on the dyno to see if there are any improved gains. I'll try to upload pictures when I get a chance.

[Modshack]

I suspected the IAT's would be up there a bit... Any open element filter is going to suffer the same fate. Unfortunately we do not know the Temp differential that results in significant timing changes...

My Insulated and shielded filters run about 5 degrees over ambient when cruising at a steady rate, so that will tell you the differences in the shielding (Plus I have the fang vents, which should bring your temps down a bit)

On the A/F, I haven't set mine up yet for that, but anytime you are in "Closed loop" the MAF and 02's will make every attempt to keep fueling in the stochiometric range of 14.7. You'll see that number bounce around a lot as small sampling corrections are made. These can also be seen in the short term fuel corrections if you've set it up to read them. Go WOT (Open loop) and you will see the true A/F tuning. Ideal will be around 12.5 but chances are it will be richer than that (lower number). You can also set the scan gauge to indicate when it goes from Closed to Open loop

[Modshack]

Originally Posted by tbss370z

I installed the intake a few months ago and did get the same negative results on the dyno like several people here have noted. I ordered some universal aluminium heat heats and noticed lowered oil temps. I have not tested it on the dyno to see if there are any improved gains. I'll try to upload pictures when I get a chance.

I don't know what Heat heats are, but lowering oil temps has no effect on intake temps. I wouldn't waste my money on another dyno run...

[kenchan]

JB- have you measured intake temps using the stock box? i wonder what kinda temps you would see then below and above 45mph...

[JB1]

Originally Posted by kenchan

JB- have you measured intake temps using the stock box? i wonder what kinda temps you would see then below and above 45mph...

Sorry for the late reply, no I have not measured the intake temps with stock intakes. I got the Scangauge after I installed the Takedas.

[JB1]

Originally Posted by Modshack

I suspected the IAT's would be up there a bit... Any open element filter is going to suffer the same fate. Unfortunately we do not know the Temp differential that results in significant timing changes...

My Insulated and shielded filters run about 5 degrees over ambient when cruising at a steady rate, so that will tell you the differences in the shielding (Plus I have the fang vents, which should bring your temps down a bit)

On the A/F, I haven't set mine up yet for that, but anytime you are in "Closed loop" the MAF and 02's will make every attempt to keep fueling in the stochiometric range of 14.7. You'll see that number bounce around a lot as small sampling corrections are made. These can also be seen in the short term fuel corrections if you've set it up to read them. Go WOT (Open loop) and you will see the true A/F tuning. Ideal will be around 12.5 but chances are it will be richer than that (lower number). You can also set the scan gauge to indicate when it goes from Closed to Open loop

Thanks for the feedback modshack. A/F ratio looks to be steady at about 14.5 but Long term fuel correction is around -5 same for short term fuel correction. I am no expert, but take that this means I am still running rich. I can also hear it, there always is a nice popping in the exhaust when I shift down at higher RPM.

I wonder if Takeda will ever come out with the heat shields that they promised Amplified. I guess we'll have to wait until after SEMA...

But I will most likely change to Stillen G3 after this winter anyway

[JB1]

Originally Posted by tbss370z

I installed the intake a few months ago and did get the same negative results on the dyno like several people here have noted. I ordered some universal aluminium heat shields and noticed lowered oil temps. I have not tested it on the dyno to see if there are any improved gains. I'll try to upload pictures when I get a chance.

Can you post your dyno results and pics of the heatshields? I am really curious!

[JB1]

So I took the Takedas out and put the stock intakes back in. With ambient temperatures currently being in the high 20's to low 30's, the intake air temperatures are at a fairly steady 6 to 8 degrees above ambient. So this translates to about 10 to 15 degrees lower then what I got with the Takeda intakes. Note: this of course with air moving, so driving at over 35/40 MPH