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-   -   how fast is FI'ed Z and satisfaction - part 2 (http://www.the370z.com/forced-induction/44473-how-fast-fied-z-satisfaction-part-2-a.html)

ImportConvert 10-27-2011 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihatepotholes (Post 1381033)
i have to disagree. coming from Evo and M3 i feel Z's stock gearing is way too tall. i raced an older cts-v once on highway it literally took forever to get out of 4th gear. hence why 4.08 equipped Z accelerate noticeable faster.

I mean with 400+whp, not stock. Stock, I really liked the gearing, but then, I am used to American cars which are traditionally geared taller.

ihatepotholes 10-27-2011 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381044)
I mean with 400+whp, not stock. Stock, I really liked the gearing, but then, I am used to American cars which are traditionally geared taller.

even for a 400whp vehicle i still feel the gearing is bit too tall for my liking. you should try a 400whp sti or evo ;) it only takes a blink of an eye to run out of 8000rpm in 3rd...

however, american cars do have very very tall gearing. i can see why you are aren't used to it.

ImportConvert 10-27-2011 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ihatepotholes (Post 1381061)
even for a 400whp vehicle i still feel the gearing is bit too tall for my liking. you should try a 400whp sti or evo ;) it only takes a blink of an eye to run out of 8000rpm in 3rd...

however, american cars do have very very tall gearing. i can see why you are aren't used to it.

All that shifting slows you down. I don't like it.

Vapiano 10-27-2011 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DIGItonium (Post 1376752)
What I like about where I'm at now is that the power band is very smooth and not peaky. It looks like an n/a power band! It also retains the N/A low end response, so the TT simply assists the engine for more thrust :)

This is exactly what I am looking for, I have spent several hours this week talking to Sam. TTs are so temping and I need to make a damn decision. To TT or not to TT?

Ron 10-27-2011 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vapiano (Post 1381098)
This is exactly what I am looking for, I have spent several hours this week talking to Sam. TTs are so temping and I need to make a damn decision. To TT or not to TT?

Dooo eeet!

phunk 10-27-2011 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1380999)
If you want a 400+whp 370Z that's going to compete with a 'vette in the power department, you have a TON of work to do. The ENTIRE driveline has to be re-done. Not just the engine/power production aspect.

cant really agree with you there.

greddy tt, osg clutch, greddy exhaust. fuel pump and injectors. reflash. volks and re11's.

have yet to run into a vette that can pull away. there was one decently modified c6 z06 that seemed dead even from many pulls. but a stock one doesnt stand a chance.

there is nothing about the vette that gives it much a traction advantage at all... the transmission is mounted a couple feet back, thats it. Otherwise its all in setup. Most 370z owners will have insanely stiff coilovers at the very least, limiting weight transfer to almost nothing. most of them will use those coilovers to slam the car to the ground and have far too much negative camber and ride on half the tire.

but if setup correctly and using some good 305 or 335 tires, i cant imagine anything about a modern corvette that is going to give it any more traction for the power.

and if we are just talking about taking down a base model vette with typical bolt ons... thats not even a challenge for a TT'd 370z... i imagine i could turn off the boost controller and run my wastegate springs 5.5psi and have no trouble with one of those. the only stock or bolt on vette that is going to beat up on a TT 370z is a ZR1

KaienZ34 10-27-2011 10:38 PM

ImPoConVo loves talking out of his azz. Don't pay him much attention and he'll go away...well hopefully.

DIGItonium 10-27-2011 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vapiano (Post 1381098)
This is exactly what I am looking for, I have spent several hours this week talking to Sam. TTs are so temping and I need to make a damn decision. To TT or not to TT?

It depends on how you feel about your car. There were times I wanted throw in the towel and give up modding this car, but so far I'm not regretting the upgrade. It definitely needs this (and oil cooler) from the factory. :driving: The car sounds so much better with the turbos as well. I don't have test pipes, so it's not raspy. Overall the engine sound through the intake and exhaust is amazing for a Z car.

With the temps in the 50s lately I can spin the tires in 2nd from a roll around 4k and beyond. I haven't tried 3rd gear yet, but normally 2nd and 3rd grips well in warm weather. So the 305s aren't enough haha.

ImportConvert 10-27-2011 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KaienZ34 (Post 1381272)
ImPoConVo loves talking out of his azz. Don't pay him much attention and he'll go away...well hopefully.

Cheese with that?

ImportConvert 10-27-2011 11:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1381263)
cant really agree with you there.

greddy tt, osg clutch, greddy exhaust. fuel pump and injectors. reflash. volks and re11's.

have yet to run into a vette that can pull away. there was one decently modified c6 z06 that seemed dead even from many pulls. but a stock one doesnt stand a chance.

there is nothing about the vette that gives it much a traction advantage at all... the transmission is mounted a couple feet back, thats it. Otherwise its all in setup. Most 370z owners will have insanely stiff coilovers at the very least, limiting weight transfer to almost nothing. most of them will use those coilovers to slam the car to the ground and have far too much negative camber and ride on half the tire.

but if setup correctly and using some good 305 or 335 tires, i cant imagine anything about a modern corvette that is going to give it any more traction for the power.

and if we are just talking about taking down a base model vette with typical bolt ons... thats not even a challenge for a TT'd 370z... i imagine i could turn off the boost controller and run my wastegate springs 5.5psi and have no trouble with one of those. the only stock or bolt on vette that is going to beat up on a TT 370z is a ZR1

I have yet to see/hear of a TT 370Z on street tires that can go WOT in first gear without plastering the pavement with rubber.

phunk 10-27-2011 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381331)
I have yet to see/hear of a TT 370Z on street tires that can go WOT in first gear without plastering the pavement with rubber.

What makes you think that a vette with the same power, using the same tires with the same alignment specs and similar spring rates and shock dampening is going to hook up in first? It's not. Don't tell me a bolt on c6 z06 can't spin tire in first without dumping the clutch. If your vette can't... Might want to take it in for some warranty work

phunk 10-27-2011 11:27 PM

Nobody is going to put 500 to the ground in first unless they are serious about doing that and willing to sacrifice in other departments. The Z doesn't attract drag racers so it's very rare someone that owns one is dedicated to setting the car up for that and willing to let go of their 19" wheels and coilovers that might as well be solid bars and ridiculous alignment specs. But if someone was in the drag racing mindset when making their decisions for all of the car and not just the making HP part, there is nothing stopping a Z from putting power down any more than a vette. Especially with a 370 since they can fit 335 tires without cutting just like cars meant to make power do

ImportConvert 10-27-2011 11:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1381335)
What makes you think that a vette with the same power, using the same tires with the same alignment specs and similar spring rates and shock dampening is going to hook up in first? It's not. Don't tell me a bolt on c6 z06 can't spin tire in first without dumping the clutch. If your vette can't... Might want to take it in for some warranty work

It can if you stab the throttle, but I can roll into it from a 5mph roll and be WOT and it holds just fine.

ImportConvert 10-27-2011 11:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1381355)
Nobody is going to put 500 to the ground in first unless they are serious about doing that and willing to sacrifice in other departments. The Z doesn't attract drag racers so it's very rare someone that owns one is dedicated to setting the car up for that and willing to let go of their 19" wheels and coilovers that might as well be solid bars and ridiculous alignment specs. But if someone was in the drag racing mindset when making their decisions for all of the car and not just the making HP part, there is nothing stopping a Z from putting power down any more than a vette. Especially with a 370 since they can fit 335 tires without cutting just like cars meant to make power do

Very cool that the 370 can take that much tire. Ford could learn a thing or two about designing the next gen mustang from that. Other than rims, anything need to be done for the 370 to accept the rubber?

phunk 10-27-2011 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381357)
It can if you stab the throttle, but I can roll into it from a 5mph roll and be WOT and it holds just fine.

Is this a base model vette? Because that type of power can be put down without much drama in a 370. But many TT guys are 500+ rwhp and that's a real big difference from a base vette.

ImportConvert 10-27-2011 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1381365)
Is this a base model vette? Because that type of power can be put down without much drama in a 370. But many TT guys are 500+ rwhp and that's a real big difference from a base vette.

I'm probably at around 440whp or so. Stock Z06. Hooks perfectly unless you stab the throttle or are on sub-par surfaces. On clean asphalt it does fine.

phunk 10-27-2011 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381358)
Very cool that the 370 can take that much tire. Ford could learn a thing or two about designing the next gen mustang from that. Other than rims, anything need to be done for the 370 to accept the rubber?

I'll let you know in spring. The best I can say is that my 305s fit with a bit of room on the inside, then I spaced them out another 15mm. I am very confident nothing will have to be done with the right offset for the camber setting. But others have already done it

phunk 10-27-2011 11:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381369)
I'm probably at around 440whp or so. Stock Z06. Hooks perfectly unless you stab the throttle or are on sub-par surfaces. On clean asphalt it does fine.

I think that first gear goes to like 60mph in the z06? That is quite a bit taller than the 370 in overall gearing.. For sure helping you. Until I get the car to hook better I bet a stock c6 z06 would get away from me from a dig but somewhere in 2nd I'm gonna catch him I think. Only ran them from a roll so no hands on with going up against one in first

Red__Zed 10-27-2011 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381358)
Very cool that the 370 can take that much tire. Ford could learn a thing or two about designing the next gen mustang from that. Other than rims, anything need to be done for the 370 to accept the rubber?

not being slammed is all that is needed. there is a ton of room under the rear fenders on the z.

ImportConvert 10-28-2011 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1381381)
I think that first gear goes to like 60mph in the z06? That is quite a bit taller than the 370 in overall gearing.. For sure helping you. Until I get the car to hook better I bet a stock c6 z06 would get away from me from a dig but somewhere in 2nd I'm gonna catch him I think. Only ran them from a roll so no hands on with going up against one in first

I guess you have come full-circle and now agree with the content of my first post in this thread.

ImportConvert 10-28-2011 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1381373)
I'll let you know in spring. The best I can say is that my 305s fit with a bit of room on the inside, then I spaced them out another 15mm. I am very confident nothing will have to be done with the right offset for the camber setting. But others have already done it

Nice. I am curious how well it hooks up on street tires, if the short wheel-base will allow for more rapid weight transfer, etc.

phunk 10-28-2011 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381436)
I guess you have come full-circle and now agree with the content of my first post in this thread.

No. Gearing like that helps but isn't needed for that power... There are faster cars with more aggressive gearing. 430rwhp can hook in a Z all day with no drama unless your setup wack

phunk 10-28-2011 01:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImportConvert (Post 1381445)
Nice. I am curious how well it hooks up on street tires, if the short wheel-base will allow for more rapid weight transfer, etc.

It's only 5" shorter. Again, weight transfer is all in the setup, it won't improve unless I go soft on the suspension ... Which I don't think I'll need to for stock bottom end power levels

LafitteZ 10-28-2011 10:39 AM

I have 548 rwhp twin turbo setup and from a dig my fathers lingenfelter supercharged z06 running 575 rwhp pulls away from me and i cant catch him mostly because we run out of track or road when we turning 150mph but if we take off at 60 i run him down every time. His car has gobs of torgue at the bottom end of the rpm range but once im reved up that z comes alive.

Nixlimited 10-28-2011 10:56 AM

I always wished for taller gearing in my STi. When you have boost, you don't want to get out of it with a gear shift. With that car I had to shift from first to 5th gear in about 8 seconds under WOT. Pain in the ***.

Red__Zed 10-28-2011 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited (Post 1381837)
I always wished for taller gearing in my STi. When you have boost, you don't want to get out of it with a gear shift. With that car I had to shift from first to 5th gear in about 8 seconds under WOT. Pain in the ***.

Truth. I stepped down to a 3.5 fd in my s2k to minimize that (3.5 is long as hell in that car)

phunk 10-28-2011 11:07 AM

id like to swap down to the 3.3 pumpkin but i dont know if i want to deal with the SRM problems

LafitteZ 10-28-2011 11:15 AM

3.3 would be nice.

phunk 10-28-2011 12:16 PM

Its definitely doable, and losing the SRM isnt making a sacrifice versus other cars, but it is one of the cool features that currently only the 370z has, I would prefer to keep it. But shifting out of first at 42mph is sort of low for a 500+ rwhp car. the 3.3 would bring it to 48mph i think, which isnt even a huge difference, but if we raised the RPM to 8000, that would get us to 51mph... which is totally reasonable and doesnt cost us more torque in each gear like a further drop in rear end ratio would.

i wonder if anyone is revving these VHR heads to 8000 yet to see how they hold up?

KaienZ34 10-28-2011 12:44 PM

I don't think they are FI'ed but there are atleast two that have rised the rev limiter to 8k. One in japan and one in the states.

LafitteZ 10-28-2011 12:47 PM

that sounds like a good idea. raise the red line would be pretty sick all in itself.

Nixlimited 10-28-2011 12:59 PM

Yeah, SRM is one of the reasons I am insisting on the sports package. As much as I do enjoy heel-toeing, I am not at a pro level. I still like to row the gearbox so I'm hoping SRM will let me do that at the track a bit more efficiently.

phunk 10-28-2011 01:11 PM

^^ you will love SRM. I drive heel toe by instinct after all these years, so it actually takes a quick adjustment in the 370z to stop trying to do it yourself. But the SRM is obvously 100% accurate so its extremely smooth and nice... for example... say you are coasting in neutral.. if you push down the clutch pedal, SRM activates... put the car in a gear without letting off the clutch and keep coasting, you will find that SRM is just sitting there holding the RPM waiting for you. When you finally release the clutch, the RPM is so dead on that you literally do not even feel that you let the clutch up, you just feel the car start to engine brake. its great.

LOL you also have to get used to not wobbling the shifter back and forth when coasting up to a light... if you do that you look like an ******* (especially with a loud exhaust), because the SRM is trying to anticipate your gear selection and the RPMs are flying back and forth all over!

KaienZ34 10-28-2011 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1382083)
^^ you will love SRM. I drive heel toe by instinct after all these years, so it actually takes a quick adjustment in the 370z to stop trying to do it yourself. But the SRM is obvously 100% accurate so its extremely smooth and nice... for example... say you are coasting in neutral.. if you push down the clutch pedal, SRM activates... put the car in a gear without letting off the clutch and keep coasting, you will find that SRM is just sitting there holding the RPM waiting for you. When you finally release the clutch, the RPM is so dead on that you literally do not even feel that you let the clutch up, you just feel the car start to engine brake. its great.

True true

LOL you also have to get used to not wobbling the shifter back and forth when coasting up to a light... if you do that you look like an ******* (especially with a loud exhaust), because the SRM is trying to anticipate your gear selection and the RPMs are flying back and forth all over!

hahahaha i did this at 1st also

phunk 10-28-2011 01:14 PM

BTW i just wanted to add that when i said 8000rpm would get us to 51mph, i meant if COMBINED with the 3.3 final drive from an automatic 350z. With stock final drive, 8000rpm would take us to just 45mph.

Nixlimited 10-28-2011 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phunk (Post 1382083)
LOL you also have to get used to not wobbling the shifter back and forth when coasting up to a light... if you do that you look like an ******* (especially with a loud exhaust), because the SRM is trying to anticipate your gear selection and the RPMs are flying back and forth all over!

Oh man, that is a habit I definitely have. Something about knowing I am not engaged in the wrong gear...

KaienZ34 10-28-2011 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited (Post 1382174)
Oh man, that is a habit I definitely have. Something about knowing I am not engaged in the wrong gear...


Just glance over at the speedo and it tells you what gear your in.

Vapiano 10-28-2011 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DIGItonium (Post 1381325)
It depends on how you feel about your car. There were times I wanted throw in the towel and give up modding this car, but so far I'm not regretting the upgrade. It definitely needs this (and oil cooler) from the factory. :driving: The car sounds so much better with the turbos as well. I don't have test pipes, so it's not raspy. Overall the engine sound through the intake and exhaust is amazing for a Z car.

With the temps in the 50s lately I can spin the tires in 2nd from a roll around 4k and beyond. I haven't tried 3rd gear yet, but normally 2nd and 3rd grips well in warm weather. So the 305s aren't enough haha.

I absolutely love my car! It's not a DD so I can deal with "the small issues" that accompany a FIed car. A gasket here and there, fixing a rattle every now and then...etc. I just don't want to have major chronic issues that makes my decision regrettable.

It's also voiding your warranty and footing expensive repairs out of pocket; but that is the chance you take for that INTOXICATING HP, SHOCK and AWE when you blow past more expensive cars:driving:

Flyboy 10-28-2011 10:47 PM

I turned off my SRM, I hate it. Every time I pull up to a light and put it in Neutral and move my shifter left/right I look like I'm showing off. I turned it off and never looked back..

DIGItonium 10-29-2011 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vapiano (Post 1382574)
I absolutely love my car... but that is the chance you take for that INTOXICATING HP, SHOCK and AWE when you blow past more expensive cars:driving:

Awesome! With enough power, 3rd gear pull from 60 MPH is very fast and smooth! That's just ~6 PSI... I want MOAR! :driving:

Seriously though, I did a quick test with temps in the high 50s and wheel hopped in 2nd.


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