That's the lowest I can go :eek:

I take it that this is the car using our first 370z twin fuel pump assembly? And I take it that its working lol

Great power, congrats.

Is this currently the most powerful 370z in the world? I would figure it is, and I bet it will be at least a year before someone goes for this much power.

What you gonna do about traction? :ughdance:

He's got a very badass traction control unit.

Phunk: yes it is! :D

About traction control ;) we have a race logic system that has worked on many GTM built cars. And as Sam told me the more power you add the more bada$$ it is! I am paraphrasing of course :)

Any updates on the GT-R manifold conversion kit?

Congrats on the numbers!!!


I'm assuming you are using 2 UPREV GT MAF's in 3 in tubes?

Thank you

There is one source for those after market maf sensors, These are the same sensors that UPrev, AAM, AMS uses, We are just applying our own Calibration on them .

Sam

Great work Sam and I'm glad to see that things are moving ahead the way you envisioned them.

This is no doubt an important achievement for the monster HP cars out there. Technically speaking, though, is there ever a way to get stock-type resolution with a MAF that still has the same voltage range and resolution (i.e. 0-5V in .01V increments)? Seems to me that no matter what, if you are pushing more air over the same range, then every increment (e.g. .01 volt) is going to represent a larger amount of incremental airflow such that your resolution is lower between those increments, right? My guess is that this is all academic, but it's always something I have been curious about. Is speed density / MAP metering any better when you get into these high HP applications?

^^^ the ECUs interpolation inbetween set voltage increments should sort through that.

IMHO speed density is only great for one thing, being bullet proof. It has no proper ability to compensate for physical changes that effect volumetric efficiency, as its tuned directly assuming a specific and static VE.

But when I say I think the speed density is bullet proof, i mean that literally. You could blast a hole in the intake manifold and the engine will idle sky high but the engine will still be able to run and function! where a MAF car, any leaks between the MAF and the cylinders can potentially shut you down or make the engine undriveable.

Aside from that, the only down side I really see to a MAF setup is the restriction of the MAF itself, but i think that these modern ones are probably completely neglible in restriction.

The relationship between voltage and airflow is not linear. Therefore, at low air flow you can still have good resolution. These MAF sensors are calibrated to have still a good resolution at low voltage 0-3V where most of the drivability and normal driving happens. In comparison to the factory ECU, it's not much different. The compromise in the resolution is only in the upper limit of the sensor. Besides, when you are at WOT, the resolution is not as critical as long as you are not maxing out the MAF's or Load Tables.

FYI, the 370Z system has a very sophisticated logic which depends on the two MAF sensors as well as the two MAP sensors. So yes the 370Z does have two MAP sensors in addition to the two MAF sensors. One is used mainly for atmospheric pressure compensation and the other is used as a switch between VVEL engine rpm control and throttle body engine rpm control. In the event that the MAP sensor for the brake booster goes below a certain threshold, it will switch to the throttle body control to make sure that there is sufficient manifold vacuum so that the brake booster can do its job.

We're very fortunate that the 370Z has dual MAF sensors so we are not completely compromising driveability and I'll bet if you take that 1000bhp Z on a test drive and test out the driveability, you'll think it was stock. I hope that all makes sense.

For the speed density vs. MAF, MAF tuning is always more precise and accurate since we're tuning based on how many grams per second of air is going into the engine. At lower altitude, you get more air, and at high altitude you get less air. The key is to have the right MAF curve that translates the amount of air going into the engine to the ECU. With speed density/MAP tuning, it's almost impossible to do on the 370Z because the VE changes so dramatically due to VVEL.

I was able to tune the G37 via a speed density system with an F-Con Vpro, but it was more of a workaround than a true tuning solution. Really it took me almost 80hrs just to get a good starting point for the car to even run. This was back in the days when there was no UpRev option and the VQ37VHR wasn't even available to the general public yet. It was an absolute nightmare, but I had no choice and got through it. It really makes me appreciate MAF tuning so much more.

^^ lol i hadnt even thought about that situation with speed density tuning with the VVEL. but it makes total sense since the manifold pressure/vacuum does not precisely correlate to engine load with this engine.. sounds like a bad time overall.

One other very important point I would like to make is that the MAF voltage (and location) has a direct impact on the automatic transmission line pressure. Therefore, if you relocate the MAF without the proper tuning, your line pressure can be adversely affected.

You mean good times :tup:

Sam

Brain splode....and i like it. Keep up the great work Sam.

What are the benefits of using these upgraded MAFs on a 450-500 rwhp Z?

There really isn't a benefit at those power levels as the stock MAF's are capable of handling the airflow just fine.

Think of it like this: if you have a stock car, there's no point in putting in bigger injectors right? Same thing with the upgraded MAF's...they only provide a benefit at high horsepower levels (600+whp).

Thanks Mike, I figured so but I read this from a vendor's website and got confused

That is true if the forced induction designer fails to compensate for the higher airflow of the turbo/supercharger by increasing the diameter of the MAF tubing. Of course you can only increase the diameter so much before you start running into other issues (fitment, resonance, turbulence, etc.).

Very interesting, especially how the throttle plates vs VVEL comes into play. I assume the MAP that watches brake-boost stuff is one the you see plugged into the top/rear area of the manifold itself. Where's the other one at?

Power Brake booster area.

Sam

7 AT upgrades :stirthepot:

Bullitt: What brand electronic exhaust cut-outs are you going to use?

Not sure yet...

x.x i want.

Grats on the positive results......

i stand corrected. Once complete, your project will push the envelope and possible be a benchmark for tuning and performance

Bullitt we need photos of your car @ SEMA ...

Damn! :yum:

Nissan 370Z - Asian imports at the 2011 SEMA Show (photos) - CNET Reviews

Nissan 370Z - Asian imports at the 2011 SEMA Show (photos) - CNET Reviews

he's going widebody, rear fenders are not done yet.

Sam, any news on the transmission upgrades..

This is a great read, guys. Good stuff!

I was under the impression that the upgraded MAF had improved resolution for those in the 300-600 power range over the stock MAF and that there were some advantages even if you weren't over the maximum flow of the stock MAF. Then again, most of my knowlege (what little I have) is on the 350.

Just for chuckles - maybe you need 4 intake tubes and equal flow tubing so that you can have 4 MAF's to get he flow per MAF back down into the higher resolution range of each MAF (not serious). I can see how the need for resolution could grow exponentially when you're talking about increasing the operating range almost four fold. Especially since you're talking about a device that is sensing temperature differences of air passing by a heated wire. At 28+ psi boost, you're facing a 3 fold increase in flow over normal atmosphere, right (14.7psi atmosphere + 28psi boost)?

Anyways, keep up the good work, guys. And keep dropping the technical info in threads like this. It's a great read for dummies like me that are trying to learn!

What's the update on the GT-R manifold?

there are only so many things you can do with the same number of cells in the graph. we would need bigger maps to maintain the same level of resolution as the stock setup, so it is amazing what they have done with tuning. one of the good reasons for having that fcon sitting in box for later with a car of this level

I was wondering about that. The way that he described it in the post was that it was due to the resolution of the MAF itself and not just that they're using the same number of cells in the tuning as they would with a stock build. I agree that the number of cells in your choice of tuning would come into play since you're programming for a wider range of variables (varying levels of boost, significant difference in injector size, upgraded MAF, fuel system, etc) using the same Base Fuel Schedule by RPM tables for tuning.

I know just enough to be dangerous inside Osiris Tuner on my NA setup, and can only imagine that the complexities of tuning something like this is an artform more than a science.