How is GTM months behind?

Your setup is beyond the standard kit, but your car is without a doubt the bench mark. I would love my car to move like yours someday!

i thought he just had the tuner kit, How is that beyond standard?

Though I feel bad for the guys with issues, it strikes me as interesting that the guy (RCZ) who has a good relationship with Stillen also has the best-performing install.

2 thumbs up for the value of good communication skills?

Over in the GTM thread, there seem to be fewer issues, so I question the validity of the statement that GTM is months behind Stillen.

The reason I even comment is that I would like to go SC at some point, but with all the uncertainty, imma wait for all the details to get sorted out.

:driving:

LOL you need to read better. the kit with 62hp less is mine and i am also running only 6 psi pully. As well it is not 62hp but what ever. As for the intake it is a non issue it preformed as needed but when Sam saw the casting he knew he could make it better. So to recape. GTM kits are as advertized and no issues. Stillen less HP then advertized meny tune issues. 8+ revisions now. and so far one blowen SC. So tell me how GTM is month behind.?

As we have seen, its extremely easy to spin both sides of the story negatively...truth is both kits have stumbled at the start, but I'm sure both sides will resolve issues. Stillen kit is a tune fix away from making 400+ without breaking a sweat. I have no idea how much the GTM one is supposed to make since no one can post numbers :stirthepot: but if what we hear is true, then they are an intake casting fix away from working fine as well.

My supercharger kit did not blow up! It looks like the seal on the main shaft was defective which caused the synthetic lube to leak out. Vortech uses this blower on most of their kits so I'm sure it was just a fluke and nothing else.

So, to clarify again.....my kit did not blow up and Stillen has done a great job to sort it out with me.

Jumped on Stillen parts in a heartbeat when I first purchased the car due to the long term branding of the name and favorable expose in various medias. My expectations were simple: fit, finish, performance and association with a proven winner.

Unfortunately, I got none of the above. Nothing fit properly, the overall quality was below average and everything underperformed Stillens reported gains. It was their front man Kyle who chuckled at me saying the exhaust/headers were installed improperly (hint: I've built entire engines and will help crew a 2300hp Xtreme 10.5 car at the ADRL world finals this weekend). At the same time numerous other ongoing reports of ill fitting products were being posted. He finally admitted to: "being the marketing person and not an engineer" and that an "engineer" would call me. No one called and I'd like to see the SAE credentials of whomever didn't call as I seriously doubt the credentials exist.

The straw that broke my 370Z's camel's back and added insult was the inability to properly tune the car. The fact Cobb has discontinued the AccessPort for the 370Z speaks volumes and adds another entry to my useless/worthless car parts inventory.

A bit more salt was rubbed into the wounds as the Stillen products I purchased appear to have very low resale value or none at all. The intake went first, someone offered me 1/2 of what I paid for the 4 month old headers and the CBE so far is a boat anchor with no takers at a $700.00 offering. Thinking about putting the exhaust back on vs sitting in a corner unused.

What's the phrase: "buyer beware." Tuff love in my book. Still like the car, just not what I bought into.

It sounds like they are saying, if you want to stay CARB legal and use their tune, get rid of your HFC's.

I'm not in Cali so sorry for dumb question.. but are HFC's legal there?

no hfc's are not street legal in Cali..

This might be the most solid argument posted on this thread. I applaud you.


Denny, I too sold my intakes, in fact I sold my G3 intake 3 times to 3 different people for a very good price. It took less than 2 days to make each sale every time I had to put it back up for sale. My oil cooler sold for a decent price too. I don't know that my parts were any different than yours. My exhaust was I think the first Stillen Exhaust on a customer Z and I've had it since without any problems other than the fact that it was touching the cross member at first. 5 minutes at an exhaust shop and $15 later, fixed. I'm not sure what your car put down, but my G3 intakes made 20something hp. In fact, intake and exhaust took me from 256hp to like 290hp on a mustang dyno.

You're right about the headers, those didn't help much, but they did make me a few more HP up on the top end in exchange for lower midrange.

Pulley worked perfectly. Oil cooler did its job on the street where it was designed to work. Supercharger worked flawlessly from the first moment we started the car until now. It actually started right up on the first press of the start button, no stumbling nothing. My Stillen j-hook brake rotors feel great. My stillen pads are perfect for daily use.

I am yet to have any of the problems you describe with any of the parts I've bought from them. They have been there for support each and every time, even when I bought Hotchkis swaybars instead of Stillen ones, Josh was there to help me get a better price and didnt even try to make me buy something I didn't want. Same thing when I bought the Seibon wing.

Not sure I have had any bad experiences with them personally. If I had known about them sooner I think I would've bought the rest of my mods from them too.

He has a smaller pulley and is running around 9 psi I believe? Anyhow, he definately has one of the highest hp consumer built supercharged Zs right now.

GTM is months behind because they only have one customer car
that works well enough that the person was willing to post his/her dyno sheet. Stillen had their first customer car done and dyno results posted in May. I would call that 5 months behind. If you go back and read all the GTM supercharger threads you see posts in august saying "dyno results next week". But, that next week hasn't come for 3 months.

As far as the 6 psi pulley goes, we've only
seen one person use it and it happens to be the only dyno result from an end user posted to this forum. Why would it be unfair to use it as a comparison to their press release, which advertised 452 whp with 8 psi boost. There's no one else to compare to. The people that have the 8 psi pulley can't develop 8 psi becasuse the supercharger unit can't keep up in the upper rev range. Still, if GTM wasn't months behind Stillen or they weren't haVing problems, you'd see dyno charts. So, the GTM kit only makes 390 whp until someone proves otherwise.

There's a saying in medicine we frequently use: if it's not documented, it didn't happen. And it's sound logic that holds up in the court of law. Using that logic, the most power you can get out of the GTM kit is 390 whp, which is 62 hp less than their press release. If gtm gets new pulleys out there, a new tune or improved charge pipe and starts getting customer into the 420 whp range where Stillen is, then it's still fair to say that GTM is months behind Stillen in that regard.

Id rather have a company behind some than one that put out a product and people cant drive their cars cuz it isnt right. When have we seen anything these days come out when they say it will and actually be ready? Nothing ive seen today. I have to say that right now GTM is looking better than Stillen even if they only have one car out right now. Stillen can say its just a minor problem but it sure is taking a looo0ong time to fix a minor problem.

Now Im sure when everything is all said and done and all the bugs are worked out both kits will do very well and be comapreable.

I believe shumby voluntarily elected to go with the 6 psi pulley because of longevity concerns with his 7AT, which is not reflective of the full 8 psi by his decision.

Ok, so one person has a reason why their car doesn't work as advertised. What about the rest? I see posts saying the 8 psi pulley doesn't deliver 8 psi. So the GTM kit is not working as advertised, but the forum users
that are GTM promoters overlook this.

There are also GTM customers who have their supercharger installed, but say they're not going to post the dyno results until their car is "ready". Just because they don't post what the problems are doesn't mean they don't exist. We've been waiting for 3 months since posting that their supercharger install was completed, but still no results. The GTM promoters were quick to attack Stillen when I posted back in July that my car was making 422 hp, but hade driveability issues. Then in August when I posted that everything was working perfectly, the GTM promoters ignored it and kept focusing on the forum users who's problems weren't resolved.

One of the most vocal disatisfied Stillen customers has been Tom Navone. When asking him if he ever received a tune that had good drivebility, he said yes, but the top end was too weak.... it only made 390 hp. But, that is the same as GTM's best example. The GTM promoters have overlooked this as well.

If GTM problems didn't exist, there would be more than one user's dyno chart posted and if they weren't having problems, they'd they would be getting much closer to 452 whp they advertise in their press release. The GTM promoters seem to overlook this as well.

You comparing a 390whp Stillen kit that did not deliver the 418whp power level when it was running 8/9psi versus a GTM kit that made the same 390whp on 6psi.

The reason 8psi was not delivered on some kits was due to the LTH's and VVEL tuning not the SC kit itself.

The best tune for me was tune #7 and my hp is 375 and torque is 295 and weiboy is in the same ballpark along with g37mobbin. Some of the other seven tunes yielded higher numbers but the drivability was bad.

I hope you are not referring to me when you say not making the full 8 psi.
I have long tube headers and we are working directly with Sam at bringing these two mods together for the better of the community. One reason I will not post dyne numbers is because my kit is a work in progress, now that does not mean it is broken or not working. I drive it everyday for the past few months and have put over 3k miles on it with only one issue so far. Hot starts were a bit off with the first tune, sent some quick data to Sam and we made the adjustments and got a new tune.

Buzzlitonian what were your final numbers? Any dyno sheets to share?

well, this is what i'm making now!

Are u satisfied with the results and drivability? Do u feel u got what u paid for?

So the latest stillen can tune is making 23 more whp on 8psi on a manual car than a GTM kit at 6 psi makes on an auto car?

Wow.

Come on now...if you had made good power you would not have waited until it was "done" to post results. It may not be broken by the definition of the word broken, but its obviously not doing what you were hoping it would. My car is a work in progress too and I'm sure I'm going to make more power when winter rolls around, but I put my numbers out there.

I mean, ok we get it, but don't BS us...

Personally though, I don't understand how you guys have the nerve to not post results YOU HAVE and then come in here and bash on the Stillen kit and the people who have actually posted their numbers. Am I the only one who sees a problem with that?

Can't we just all get along? I mean really, this is getting stupid. How old are we? Didn't know a bunch of 19 year olds could afford this car yet???? Excuse me while I duck now..........:stirthepot:

I'm never satisfied but it is what it is and I'm gonna enjoy it!

There is still a few drivability issues that needs to get resolved. it still pings on the low end and my hot start is showing again. I'm not too worried about the hot starting, just the low end ping is what's really concerning me. I'm sure uprev or stillen is gonna fix it soon just don't know how much longer and I can't wait to get everything squared away and get the stupid carb sticker.:icon23:

is the pinging similar to a knock?

Both are forms of detonation, so in theory, yes.

How about trying some sort of octane booster to help with the pinging issues? Do you buy gas from the same place all the time?

We are also wondering the fuel he has access to as well, if not a habit in going to the same station. That being said, we should have some adjustments soon to help with the remaining quirks Weiboy has noticed. His G is very prone to tip-in knock.. which can be present on stock vehicles.. but seems to be very prevalent with his.

Wei.. switch the stations up.. and make sure it's a brand name station, and if it has been.. a different one..

out of curiosity has anyone performed any compression tests or leak down tests at all on the motors after install and some hard driving? I know that these motors are already showing signs of oil consumption here and there (not as prevalent as the older VQ motors by any means), so I'm just curious if these motors are holding up to the task.

When comparing GTM and Stillen kits please note that there are differences in kit components and this provides a huge range of variables that can change overall performance numbers, even though they're both FI, it's still not comparing the same apple to the same apple.... with that said, BOTH companies have had reputations with " exaggerating " numbers on what they claim (I have seen this with my own eyes first hand with a few FI built cars I've closely worked on). So you cannot take their claims as ammunition to compare the two really either.

what really matters is how they drive real world. dyno graphs don't tell enough of a story on how the car drives.

For example: when I had my stillen SC 350Z, it would dyno low even though I would be running 100 octane, custom stage 4 and new maps etc. BUT the way the car drove was great, linear power output all the way through to the upper RPMs etc. Sure it wasn't 420 HP that any stock motor Z could pull with a decent TT kit on it, but I had power in daily driving where they didn't. I didn't have oil temp issues like some of them did. I didn't have to worry about leaking wastegates like the older Greddy kits, I could go on and on. Real world driving is what makes a kit really shine. I can illustrate where having more power doesn't mean that the same car is any faster, in fact it can be much slower, all things are relative. Take the last generation Mustang Shelby GT500 vs the normal C6 vette. The shelby has 100hp more. yet it's slower in the 1/4 mile, any road course, 0-60, etc. In nearly every test, it's not faster if anything it's equal. Yes, they are two different cars completely, but if you're only looking at numbers and dynos (which it seems this thread is really all based on), then there you have it lol

If you really care about power numbers and that's your main selling point, save, build the motor, and go crazy anything less is a total waste. if not, why argue back and forth about numbers on paper.

Nope, still would not have.
People are waiting for the full 8PSI run so I will wait to post what they want. There will be plenty of standard GTM stage 1 builds that I can wait. I do not BS nor do I intend to sway numbers in favor of one company. I will say I was a bit shocked on the original pulls making 5PSI, but then we got down to analyzing it and found out what was going on and continue to work on it as quickly as we can.

Are you assuming you know what I want and what I plan to do with my car? When I originally talked to Sam the very first time, I told him I might end up running a 6PSI pulley with stock headers/cats just so I keep it at 400whp and no more. Then we threw in the idea of LTHs and started on a different path, and we are where we are today. No problems, nothing is broken, everything is working as intended and we hope to combine the LTHs with the stage 1 kit so everyone can enjoy this combination.

On your last paragraph, Shumby has posted his results, other G37 guys have on the other forum. I believe I am one of the first with a completed 370z kit while the others have opted to wait for the new piping instead of finishing then having to go back and change the piece out. Also, before you get all jumpy on this revised piece, nothing is wrong with the current one. Sam is improving the current design to be even better, if I never got the new piece I would never care, but he is sending me it free of charge to help all SC owners have a better kit.

You really want to start a mud slinging war RCZ, great, but do some research before posting instead of just putting the blinders on and typing. I am favor of neither Stillen nor GTM, I have owned products from both and many other companies. I buy what I want, use it, if I enjoy it or hate it I report back exactly what I have found wrong and right. We are all happy you have a working SC kit, but as it has been pointed out no one here seems to care really. You got a custom tune, are running other upgraded items Stillen has yet to test themselves and are putting down good numbers. Congrats, but lets move on past that point and look at what is going on with the majority of owners, from both sides. Stillen is still having issues with their tune and GTM customers are just waiting for a new piece to bolt down and be on the road.

Still loving my SC

Another person with no problems on his s/c, people need to STOP protecting GTM so much. I mean it is clear, that the problems werent design flawed, apparently like the GTM pipe as some are saying, its the tune.

I dont know, I think both companies are great, but as a vendor and a sales guy in general, Stillen is doing the best they can. People keep knocking it, but like most have said, GTM isnt really out their producing numbers they claim. Their is no perfect kit yet, though Stillen seems to be coming out ahead on this one now that issues have been addressed.

Good to see Stillen posting again, I personally am glad to see you guys back throwing in the comments here and there.

+1

Stillen gets over the tune issue and the kit is perfect.

Wow, really?
Because I have not been on both sides here at all? Geez, you are blinded by stupidity and assumptions. I am really tired of this BS that is spotted in both threads. I could careless who has a better unit or who 'wins or loses' in this imaginary game on the internet. I picked the company because of what I wanted, but when people go around spouting wrong information, it is the reason I use the icon for facepalm.

You might want to go look at my posts again, I am by far the most neutral in any of these threads even with the ownership of a GTM unit. I really do hope Stillen pulls this through, competition is better all around and only one option can create even more problems (companies get lazy, ignore customers, etc.).

You want to attack me go ahead, but be very careful before you make a reply and re-read your own post even and as it is filled with some wrong information. Also, as a vendor I respect what you bring to this community, but maybe you should take look into staying neutral or not replying on topics like this.

Here I will help you out:

I will keep calm here, but what did I say was wrong? That GTM DOESNT HAVE A PIPE that needs to be modified, or that STILLEN DOESNT have an issue with their tune?

I am sorry, maybe you should go back and read what is going on on the forums.

So...I read an article where the 370Z with the Stillen kit was tested. Ran mid/high 12's@113 and did 0-60 .2 seconds faster than stock. I did not see that they dyno'ed it.

Can I take this to mean that yes, Stillen has worked out the tune-issues before sending out a press-car, or no, they have not, and work still needs doing?

Only 0.2 seconds faster than stock?! WTF? 0-60 times are what I live for. Maybe I need to rethink the whole FI idea. :shakes head:

You usually won't see a huge drop in the 0-60 time with FI. The key to dropping 0-60 times is getting traction. Before I did suspension work on my S, I would run about a 5 second 0-60 time, but trapping around 145 in the quarter mile.