DDMotorsports: Kognition Design Wing Development
 

Hey everyone! Just wanted to start a thread for this since there are a few track junkies out there with 370Zs :). The DoubleDownMotorsports.com Time Attack Project 370Z is in the hands of the very talented Kognition Design. Kognition design was responsible for the dry carbon hood, doors, front splitter, and canards on my old time attack 350Z and his main focus now is producing increidble dry carbon wings that can already be seen on some of todays top winning time attack cars like JC Maynet's Harman Motive Subaru STI, PTuning's Scion tC, and JIC's Porsche GT2. He is making a production version wing that will be specifically designed for the 370Z using my car and this will be the thread to watch the process!

Here is the first step! The stock spoiler has been removed (and left a bunch of holes in its wake :mad:) and the locations for the wing base have been chosen...

http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdev1.jpg

The wing final design and specs of the wing will be decided shortly as we are waiting on the 2010 Redline Time Attack Rulebook to be released later today actually. We want to make sure the new wing fits within their Street Class rules.

YAY!!! I am glued to this thread and cant wait to see the Progress :tup:

I cant wait to see how the your Z will look in the end of the project

Me too. I really really want to get a little more agressive body kit, like the Nismo or something but budget is not there. Trying to find a body kit sponsor, but that isn't going well either. I think if the rest of the body kit looks a tad more agressive and aerodynamically functional it would compliment the wing even more. The wing will be amazing though. Kognition's work is incredible and I have seen his wing elements and they are :drool:

in for pics :)

Here are some photos from Kognition to show his work. These aren't of my wing just other wings he has done...

Wing for the JIC Time Attack RX8. This is not the normal weave pattern he uses...
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogrx8wing.jpg
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogrxawing2.JPG

Then here is the mock up piece of his new adjustment design. Really cool design that allows you to easily adjust at the track without having to measure and re-measure to find your angle. Just pull the pins out and move the wing to the desired position and put the pins back in. Adjustments are made in incriments of 1 deg.
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com...ngskeleton.jpg

Then here is a diagram of it...
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdiag.jpg

And a closeup of the dry carbon weave that he usually uses.
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogmantis.jpg

The 370Z wing will be made to fit within the street class Redline Time Attack rules which mandate a max width of 68" and a max cord of 14". It can also not extend back past the rear most part of the car, and cannot sit taller than the tallest part of the car. Plans were to build within those specs anyways as the car doesn't need much more than that.

Wing stands are getting water jetted today! Mold making process starts tonight :). Hopefully we will get some more photos soon.

Sounds promising, keep us posted!

Honestly though, I think I'm gonna shy away from huge wings, even with its functionality. I'm thinking a nice CF spoiler like the one from the FRP package will complement the car nicely, especially when I'm done with it :) Doesn't mean I can't appreciate the DDM car when it's done though

Thats Awesome! Kognition is quality stuff!

Keep us posted, can't wait to see it on the car.

Only Z34 i've seen so far w/ GT style wing is SLR Car.

Look's like they tried fitting a Voltex Z33 wing

http://jonsibal.com/bpimages/slrZ34_1.jpg

Thanks guys! Big GT wont be everyone's style but for me function is sexy and this wing will be incredibly functional, built specifically for the 370Z and specifically built to the Redline Time Attack Street Class (or Street Tire Class for 2010) rules. :)

Speaking of...Paul, when are you bumping your Z34 up to Street Class to keep me company? :) I was actually going to run in Stock Class for the finals with you but this wing puts me back in Street.

Cool, you know I'm in ! :)

I think the rule on Redline TA Street are pretty consistent with other series... it's a good spec to design to... and as you say, probably all the car needs, especially when paired with a functioning undertray/diffuser

One thing I like about the sunline racing setup is the possibility of running two airfoils... wonder if given the design limitations you guys are setting about following (width, cord, height, outrig) if we could run two foils within that... ?

Also, what trade-offs did you consider on mounting point ? seems like the logical place to mount it, but wondering if there's a 'harder' surface to connect with somehow ???

New photo!

These are just mock up stands. The final stands will be waterjetted, not solid in order to reduce weight. As you can see he changed the mounting location for the stands but is still finalizing the design for the bases, but they will end up being fairly large to disburse the extra load the wing is forcing down evenly across the hatch to minimize flex and make sure the hatch doesn't get damaged.

http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdev2.jpg

Lookin' good.:tup:

Will you fill in the holes from the stock wing, if so what is the best method?

I think once the bases are done, only the middle three holes will be left. I will have them filled and painted professionally because I am picky and my car is going to SEMA. Kognition did say that those little round plastic clips from the engine bay do fit in there and a small bead of epoxy will seal it from water, plus I am sure that you can find lower profile plugs at your local auto parts store that will work and you can even paint those to match your car.

^ Having them glassed or welded shut with some body work and allot of paint. But that can cost around 500.

Carbon fiber hatch if there is one (we were working on one but lack of demand has slowed us down. We only have one side of a mold and we haven’t made the other)

But the cheapest way is to get little interior fasteners (little button clips they use on cars) paint them white, and pop them in.

That’s around 3 bucks for a pack of clips at auto zone and then maybe 20 bucks for a spray can from automotivetouchups.com where you can get a color matched paint can and spray them your self. (I think that’s the link)

Other then that I love that wing!

AHH he beat me with a reply while I was typing... :P

Here is a side shot he just sent me!

http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdev3.jpg

Need to see more of that haha

I have to admit though, something seems wrong with that pic. One of the angles is irking me, but I can't quite put my finger on it yet.

I think I know what you mean... you're probably used to seeing these mounted up farther forward on the rear deck. This one is rearward of a typical car you'd see on the street. E.g., imagine if the mounts jutted straight up from the horizontal section of the rear deck... is that what's bugging you ?

More update pics!

Here is the finished, but un-coated, stand...
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdev4.jpg

Now here's where it might get a little confusing, or at least I was a little confused at first. The large metal piece pictured here will be used to help make the base of the wing. Now the bottom edge of the piece shows how large of a surface area the wing bases will take up in order to distribute the force the wing will be putting down on our flimsy aluminum hatches. Now I believe the actual final base will only go upwards to the mounting bolts for the stands. The rest of the metal piece in the photo is just extra. Get it? The bases will not be as tall or large as the actual metal piece, but they will be as wide as the bottom edge.
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdev5.jpg

Either way, I pick the car up from Kognition on Sunday and drive it back to Vegas. There is a chance that I will be driving it back without a finished wing as it will be hard to get the actual finished product done in time, but he is confident that the molds will all be done by the time I pick the car up and then he will deliver and install the wing sometime before SEMA.

In other exciting Kognition news, he has just been commissioned by Chris Rado and World Racing to build wings for their famous bi-winged beast of a Scion tC! Pretty big compliment to Kognition coming from a team who obviously focuses majorly on aerodynamics.

i think that is part of it, but then again i haven't really put a LOT of thought into it....there's still something else haha, but that's a big part of it yea

Picked the car up yesterday from Kognition. Molds are done and he is making the final product this week, then coming up to Vegas to install the finished product sometime towards the end of the week!

Some more updated pics! He has been taking his time a little with the wing itself since he isn't able to install it until this coming weekend anyway, but here are some updated pics!

Here is one of the test bases made from the mold. The final version may be a tad different shape on the bottom, but we'll see.
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdev7.jpg

And here is the mold for the wing itself. :)
http://www.doubledownmotorsports.com/kogwingdev6.jpg

Looks really heavy imo

What the mold? I am sure it is.

So we finally got the opportunity to get the wing on the car and test it at Auto Club Speedway this past weekend. Auto Club Speedway is probably the fastest track on the west coast as it uses 2/3 of the NASCAR oval. My 370Z was reaching speeds upwards of 140-145mph at the end of the front straight. What better place to test a wing.

Well, lets just say we learned a lot. The good news is that the wing produces MONSTER downforce. The new profile Kognition came up with is nothing short of amazing. The bad news is, this first prototype will have to be revised some in the strenght department. The wing produced so much downforce at ~120mph that it literally folded both ends of the carbon fiber wing like a straw, something I didn't even think was possible. Here we were concerned about the hatch mounts, which held up incredibly (you can probably tow the car with them), but the weak point was the carbon fiber itself.

Although it is a bummer that the wing will need some re-designing in the strength department, Kognition and myself are both as excited as we can be that the wing was far more effective than we had hoped. The wing broke at the end of my warm up lap so I didn't have too much time on the track with it, but just judging by how the car felt on the warm up lap, lets just say I can't wait until the revised version is done.

Kognition already knows what he needs to revise to keep it as light weight as possible (the one we tested was only 5 lbs.) but be strong enough to hold up to the downforce it is producing.

Anyway, here are some photos. Also the end plates will also be dry carbon fiber on production models.

Everything ready to get installed!
http://www.bonannimotorsports.com/kogwingdev9.jpg

Wing mounts and uprights installed.
http://www.bonannimotorsports.com/kogwingdev10.jpg

The whole shebang installed and waiting to go out on track. 68" wide, as tall as the roofline, and built to the extent of the Redline Time Attack Street Class rules!
http://www.bonannimotorsports.com/rtafinals091.jpg

And the area where the wing folded like a straw. It was identical on the other end as well.
http://www.bonannimotorsports.com/kogwingdev13.jpg

Not a very flattering angle, but on track shot probably 30 seconds before melt down.
http://www.urbanracer.com/gallery/ga..._2009/0094.jpg

Congrats on the relative overall success of the prototype.

Would pushing the wing mounts farther out a little more towards the edge of the trunk increase the strength of the outer edges of the wing, seeing as that was the weak point?

It would but where they are at right now is the strongest part of the hatch. It would be easier just to run titanium rods or something through the wing to keep it rigid.

True. Keep us posted.

Love it, but I have to drive my car on the street haha. I wouldn't be caught dead with a wing like that in my neighborhood. If there was an easy way to switch it on and off, I would consider running it at the track. I personally think that your test was a success. Like I've said before, they call it "testing" for a reason. Time to retest. Remember the goal is not to bend, not just not to break. A wing that bends too much is useless too.

Its easily removeable. Takes an allen wrench and 5 minutes.

It would be really neat if they designed a low profile wing that slipped over the mounting arms, or used the same bolt holes that you could have for street use.

Lol Im sure its easy to take it off Mike....the holes...not so much.

Mike, the wing looks good. The legs are perfect. Just the top wing and side blades have more shape to them.

Wow... I'm getting the same wing made and was looking for more pictures based on your name paul2x heh.... That's awesome that it snapped lol.... and that's the 68" version im getting a 72" wing made for my widebody 240sx lol.

Ok, tested the new version of the wing on Friday and no problems whatsoever! Everything is SOLID as a rock :). Here is an email that Kognition sent out about it...

"This week, testing was completed at Willow Springs Raceway of the new Variant 1 track wing. The wing surpassed performance expectations on the test car, time attack driver Mike Bonanni's 370Z. We were able to make some significant strength improvements during the testing phase. The main focus was on wing rigidity, and range of adjustability. The wing is adjustable from 5 degrees to 18 degrees angle of attack in one degree increments. Kognition has focused on product performance, reliabilty and ease of setup. Kognition has set out to produce very high quality track wings for drivers looking for every available advantage for downforce and adjustment. An extra value added feature for customers, is the ability to provide custom CFD downforce/drag/HP charts for a given custom wingspan. Customers want more value for their dollar, and we are here to answer the call. With extensive use of CFD simulation, CAD drawing, cnc and waterjetting, Kognition wings are close tollerance wings. Each wing is vacuum bagged on a high precision cnc cut tooling that is 1/10,000" in tollerance. Kognition's founder Mike Mishler, brought this discipline in from the world of F1 racing. "We had to bring the market up to speed and up to par for quality performance wings that can take severe abuse from both driver and extreme environments". All Kognition wings are produced using only 100% aerospace grade structural carbon fiber. And molded using the best vinyl ester resin available. Nothing has been compromised. We are in fact bringing F1 quality construction to the aftermarket. The new wing profile is called the "Variant 1". And is scheduled to be produced in kit form for the following platforms for 2010: Evo 8,9,10 / Honda S2K / Mazda RX8/ Nissan 350Z, 370Z / Nissan 240SX (S13 fastback, S14) / Hyundai Genesis
Please contact Kogniton for more information at (619)961-8945 or email: <contact@kognitiondesign.com>"

And some photos...
http://kognitiondesign.com/370-1.jpg

http://kognitiondesign.com/370-2.jpg

http://kognitiondesign.com/370-3.jpg

http://kognitiondesign.com/370-5.jpg

Looks great... any words to share on how the car felt at different speeds ? did you notice understeer ? time to add some front downforce now, huh ?

Thanks Travis. I will be doing a full writeup on my blog about the wing testing tomorrow and will link it in this thread. :) It is definitely producing a good amount of downforce though thats for sure.

This thing is huge :eek2: But im sure it is functional, great job!