Interior LED issue

[littlephilly]

I ordered the LEDs for my interior/license plate a few days back. Everything has been fine but the driver side half of the map light keeps burning the bulb out after only a few hours. It has done this with two LEDs so far in the past day, its getting frustrating. Passenger side has been okay, I just am baffled as to why they keep burning out on the driver side. I've tried putting the non-functional ones on the passenger side and trunk area but they don't work there either, leading me to believe they're shot. Has anyone else had an issue like this? I don't want to keep getting more LEDs only to have them die within hours.

[Trips]

if you put back your stock bulbs will it work ok? if not have the dealer take a look at what is causing the short, if so the led you're using are the incorrect one's and will burn out. What part # are you using for lic plate?

[Viera]

Are you sure they're burnt out? I've had one of my dome lights go out, as well as a license plate light. All I did was securely fit them on again and they're working just fine. They seem to be really loose.

[littlephilly]

the stock bulbs are back in and work fine. never had any issues before the LEDs either. yeah i've tried putting them back in, and putting them into the other side but still didn't work.

[Trips]

Originally Posted by littlephilly

the stock bulbs are back in and work fine. never had any issues before the LEDs either. yeah i've tried putting them back in, and putting them into the other side but still didn't work.

You do know that if you install them and don't work, you may have the bulb reversed, and have to reinstall them reversing them, they are polarity sensitive.

[Chupacabra]

The only way to kill in an LED is to overcurrent them, which drives the junction temp of the die close to 136+C and they short if white, open if other colors.

it really depends on what LED's you are running... a good set of LEDs can hold 700mA without an issue and over 1 Amp if properly cooled. A set of normal LED's usually run at 50mA up to 250mA... before they die....


I would make sure you are not:

1)over current (ing) the LED in the drivers side...

2) you have proper cooling... While they come mounted on a star board:



it might not be enough to keep them cool, and you will hit junction temps in the 140C and kill the dye... once the dye goes there is no recovery for the LED...

If you feel there are a little bad LED's go buy some top LED

Luxeon or Cree make the best LED's in my experience...

Luxeon provides the REBEL line, which has the following colors:

warm white, neutral white, cool white, PC amber, amber, red, red-orange, green and blue... they can run at 500mA on a star board without an issue:




Cree: has the XP-E line, which has all the same colors, the LED is a little smaller, and runs at 700mA without an issue:



With Cree if you just want white, you can also get the XP-G same footprint as the XP-E but runs more efficient, being a newer type of INGan chemistry.


and if you are really crazy....

go for the CREE MC-E line... its a 4 die chip, it comes in warm, neutral and cool white, as well as an RGBW chip (one red, green, blue and white die)

These things at 350mA put out 430 lumens which is about the same as a 100W bulb.




You will be paying a higher price for them... the Rebels can run about $4-5 a piece, Cree XP-E about $6-7, with the MC-E depending on bin as high as $30... but the MC-E is over kill.....



but step one, measure the Vf and Current you are supplying... most LED's will require around 3-3.5 Vf to run.

[littlephilly]

thanks for all the replies. Yes, I realize they are sensitive to polarity, and have tried putting them in both ways in both driver and passenger side lights.

[DIGItonium]

Use some rubbing alcohol to clean the connection. It might be loose in the socket. Here's my setup Chupacabra mentioned using a 350mA driver:

[Chupacabra]

^^ nice and clean setup dude.

350mA is usually the Typical value for LED's.... it is what can keep your junction temp low enough to get close to the claimed 25k hours manufacturers recommend.

[littlephilly]

thanks guys. I suppose i should check voltage and current across each side? I've got a voltmeter somewhere around here. Other than that I got some more LEDs coming maybe the third time is a charm for that spot. Its a shame, the other LEDs that work look great and I'd love to have that look in the map light as well.

[DIGItonium]

Try plugging the LEDs to a 9V battery to see if it lights up. Most LED bulbs are cheaply made so it is prone to cold solder, death due to being overdriven, or component failure due to lack of quality. I got "burned" by these LEDs and was never satisfied with it, so I made my own

You don't need the meter to check the LEDs. Simply connect the bulbs to the 9V battery (assuming we're talking about automotive LED bulbs, not standalone LEDs).

[Chupacabra]

Even stand alone LED's if mounted to a star board, you can connect to a 9V battery to check....

Except for those 20mA 5mm LED's those can take only AAA battery.

[littlephilly]

thanks Chupacabra. 9v wouldn't light them either. I'm going to give one more of the same LED a try to see if it can last up there, if not i'm going to use your setup

[DIGItonium]

Early FIY for your DIY...

Look up P/N 7027-D-350 on DigiKey to get your 350mA driver, and drive it with a high current LED of your choice.

I'm a Luxeon guy, but they've since switched over to the Rebels (small surface mount). The Rebels are a bit more delicate, but the brightness is pretty amazing. Each of my reverse lights has a Tri-Rebel star, and it's way brighter than my gf's daytime running light.

[Chupacabra]

Seconded FYI....

The Rebel package is better suited for temp changes than the New CREE xp-e package....meaning as the LED warms up you loose less lumen output, and your chromaticity does not shift as dramatic.

All of Luxeons lines except for the new REBEL package is going obsolete, especially the luxeon style III, which most of you use... so withing 1 years time you will not be able to replace them... so try and go with the new rebel. This will not be a severe problem for these type of applications... i had two of out products go into massive redisgn because of this though, which sucked.

CREE Xp-E actually puts out more lumen output in the color ranges than Luxeon rebel, but Luxeon rebel is the king when it comes to the neutral and cool white LED.

Difference??? the cree xp-e is a little smaller than the Rebel.



and it is 1/4 the size of the Luxeon style III most of you guys use.



There is a company called FRAEN.. they make reflectors and lenses for the Cree and Rebel... I don't know if they will fit in this application because of space... but a good wide angle lens, can provide cleaner light and thus require just one Rebel instead of 3 or 4 to achieve the same Lux or foot candel numbers.



Most LED's come with things called BINS... you can control Bins for:
-Light intensity (lumens)
-Foward voltage (vf)
-Chromaticity

When you buy the LED you can specify what you want... except for CREE you cannot control Foward Voltage with them because their range is very tight from the get go.


Rebel LED's.... in my experience as of late have been a very problematic LED... when i order 80lm parts i get 40lm instead... I doubt this really concerns this application since its what we call Low power illumination... so just keep it in the back of your mind.