I think maybe everyone has gotten off on the wrong foot here because all that's happened is this kid has gotten defensive and I foresee this thread going on and on, when it should have ended 3 pages ago.

I think what most people on here are trying to say is, we believe it's a good idea for you to double check your numbers. You don't have to listen to people on this board (though I'd advise it), but do your own research. Maybe have another go around with a different dyno. You could just go around and state your initial readings as fact, but you will keep getting the same reactions, I guarantee it.

First off... I didn't call you a hater. But I find your words "We aren't hating, but your are now giving us a reason to."ironic, as they seem to underline the definition in my signature.

Second, "Do i think i have 330 WHP?" well obviously after todays discussion i do not think so. Did i think so before? Yes, as I trusted the opinion and technology of professional shop.

Third, "Why did i post the numbers in my signature?". Simply for the same reason you posted your Numbers "RCZ", in your signature. I think you should take your numbers of your signature as well, cause i bet you their are wrong. Cause if you think you are making those numbers with your mods, my point was, my stock car wasn't that far off it. Which seems to be the point that you are still neglecting.

Besides, its my signature, not yours.

Again, not saying you are hater nor i did so before. As i have already mentioned in my previous posts, which you seemed to ignore. I now realize that number is overrated.

Oh and sorry I hurt your e-feelings with the word "hater"

BTW, here is the DYNO Results from the BASE 370Z that ran the same day, on the same DYNO. If the owner wants to share his mods, he can. I can't say what he had, as i don't know.

http://www.the370z.com/members/diabl...7-scan0001.jpg

=================
Here is mine again (again i will upload clear picture tomorrow):
http://www.the370z.com/members/nismo...2-nismo370.jpg

SIDE BY SIDE:
http://www.the370z.com/members/diabl...7-scan0001.jpghttp://www.the370z.com/members/nismo...2-nismo370.jpg

Hey thats my Dyno sheet. :-). Rob, gots to tell me what Performance Motors say when you tell them about this thread.

Like I said earlier dont worry about how bad people slam you its just an internet forum.



DAN

Not there? You mean it didn't beat the Audi supercar that cost three times as much $$$$? Shocking.

MT loved the car, in fact the pro drive said it was the best car on the track out of the entire field.

I'm curious...why is your dyno sheet a crappy scan while someone else's is a digital file? Where did you get the digital file for the other guy's car? And why don't you have one of your own? Not "hating", just asking. Seems weird?..................:ugh2:

I can answer that question. I scanned my sheet when i got home. I have a scanner at home and wanted to post the pic to the thread that had all the other dudes that went to the dyno day. With all of the pretty harsh comments about his IPhone picture, i guess it just made sense to put this pic in this thread.

Hey Rob watsup, sorry i took so long to come defend you...But I had the other nismo that was there...My first run stock i made 310whp and 238 trq...My second run with berk tech. test pipes i made 332whp and 252trq. Regards if its accurate or not i got a huge gain with just the test pipes, so im happy with it. What Rob put down is wat he put down...Maybe it reads high or maybe it doesnt, who cares, stop flaming the guy. Go flame performance motorsports if you gotta problem with the #'s....

:drama:

Thanx guys!
As Valentino said... we live, we learn.
I sure did learn a good lesson, on how nasty people get when they learn that someone else is better or more succesfull then they are, regardless of the truth.

Forgot my Dyno sheet at home, will have to scan it tomorrow.

:roflpuke2:
I just do not know how to respond, really you want to make a statement like that.

don't...
oh and take your HP number of your sig, its wrong.

This thread gets even funnier, really, people are trying to help you and teach you about your car and you make comments as per the one I quoted. Yes this is a forum, yes there are going to be people are blunt with you, but read what they are trying to say (past any insults or criticism) and learn.

I did not know much in terms of power for this car, but before I went for my baseline dyno I read around the forums with other members and got a feel for what I expected. Even with your car, which has a factory exhaust and tune you could easily see what to expect and understand what you got might not be 100% accurate.

You still don't get it, do you??......:shakes head:

Duly noted!!! Thanx!

No I got it, and ready to close this thread.
Let's leave this thread behind. I will post the updated numbers from more accurate DYNO. Again thanx for all the info.

:icon18:

For the love of God, man, get your head out of your a$$.

No, but it should be just a tad closer to the Cayman S; was that not the Z's performance target. FAIL in this test big time. IMO, it should have been a bit closer to the GT500, but obviously Ford's time on the chasis along with the gobs of more power spank the Z.

To your point, good new on the feel of the car, but it's numbers should have been much better. I bet a tuned Base+Sport with about 100 pounds of weight savings will put the Z in a better light. Nismo, not so much for.

Good points. I do think a regular Cayman is a much better comparo for a Nismo than a Cayman S, and I also thought the regular Cayman was the benchmark, but maybe I'm wrong there. The Audi should not even be in the test (wtf were they thinking, why not drop a $300,000 Ferrari in while they are at it), or at very least they should have included a Nissan GT-R!

I'd love to see the same test at a track like Lime Rock. Laguna's straights give enormous advantage to the big-HP beasts, imho.

The MT test was Apples and Oranges....and bananas...and grapes....:shakes head:

And MT, imho, is the worst car mag out there................................

The test was to compare cars they considered to be "driver's cars." The GTR is far from, arguably with the most diluted and artificial feel of any modern performance-car.

"Laguna's straights?" By no means do I consider myself an expert on Laguna with only 80 or so laps under my belt, all of which HPDEs as opposed to countless of competitive laps around Infineon and T-Hill, but I have yet to encounter an actual straight-away on that track. Perhaps you have a little more insight than I do, but Laguna does not provide an advantage to "big-HP beasts" by any stretch of the imagination. The track technically does not have a straight, nor is there a portion where you can wind out more than two gears at wide-open throttle. But, again...perhaps you know better than I do.

I have never driven Lime Rock, but if memory serves me right, its layout is much more advantageous with added power as average-speed on Lime Rock is significantly greater than Laguna. Regardless, the Nismo's second-to-last lap-time is abysmal, considering the live-axle 3900 lb. GT500, 3900 lb. Camaro SS, 4300 lb. automatic, 4-door XFR, and joke of an open-diffed 135i all soundly beat it, disregarding the other performance cars.

Of course it is. I'm sure your opinion would be no different if the NISMO trounced the competition and came in first, too.

Any magazine which says something negative about your favorite car or doesn't place it in 1st in a comparo is a crappy magazine.

Ok guys

My name is Alex and I represent the shop that hosted the Dyno Day... it was done at Performance Motorsports (New Page 1)

Dyno in question is a Mustang AWD Variable Load Based Dynamometer
Last calibrated the morning of the dyno day. We recalibrate the dyno weekly to make sure everything is within spec since we use it heavily throughout the work week. We are UPRev's #1 Pro Tuner and our in house tuner is constantly on the dyno tuning mostly 350zs and G35s, majority of which are boosted.

The way our dyno differs from a dyno dynamics is the way load is distributed... iirc the dyno dynamics has a set percentage that it applies evenly throughout the RPM band. Ours is a variable load based dyno which simulates road conditions. We plugged in OEM specs of the 370z before dynoing the cars.

The way we dyno is the same way as the pics shown below... with 3 fans blowing up front. The dyno is in a soundproof room with a vacuum for the exhaust fumes. All the participants were setup the same way and given their standard SAE corrected final figures. They all ranged from 304rwhp to the OP's posted rwhp. Even had an 04 G35c w/ a Vortech SC doing 34xrwhp w/ a really messed up tune from another shop.

Basically what I want to point out is that by no means did we "pad" numbers or do any changes to the dyno to get desired results. A couple of the guys did before and after mods dynos and the gains are pretty much in line with what has been seen throughout this forum. I will hope that the rest of the dyno participants can take some time and post their results.

I am not sure why the outputs were high... our shop GTR in stock trim dynoed @ 410awhp iirc... And we are consistently within less than 10-15 whp difference from the closest competitor shop's dyno output (he has an eddy current Dynojet).

It could be the way our dyno is setup where pretty much the car is sealed in a room etc.? or maybe our rollers need servicing? or a million other things.... but bottom line is, like what was mentioned by others before.... A dyno is best used a reference to gains or losses from modifications done to the test vehicle and for tuning purposes. Wanna know how fast a car really is? Go race the other guy or go to the strip and get your trap speed, calculate that with vehicle weight and some other factors that i cant remember of the top of my head, maybe someone can shed light on that formula?

So I'll try in the next dyno day to see how far off these first set of reading are.... also our shop 370z with Greddy TI-C exhaust, Berk Test Pipes, Injen Long Intakes pulled 316rwhp... but it also has only 2xxx miles I believe, how far off is that from the norm?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7.../dynoday18.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v7.../dynoday13.jpg

I just found this thread. It's very um . . . interesting. To the OP, while I share in some of the cynicism expressed by others thus far, I do want to say that I appreciate your sharing of the information you have. The sharing of information, however 'out of profile' that information may be, is not something that should be discouraged, imo.

:iagree:

Agree also. Think it's a case of simply not knowing better, new to the 370Z dyno world and believing what he saw was true. It's how we all learn at times. No harn, no foul.

The internet can be a bit harsh at times as you're not in front of the person and keyboards usually don't hit back. Think we are all guilty at times.

Give the Cobb another try as you as I were in about the same boat. After downloading the newest version of their software and a dyno session on Friday, the car picked up. Finally!!!!!

If you would like, more than willing to share my tuning/log files and your welcome to them as none are available from Cobb. Just remember each car is different, probably different gas, different weather, etc. and it will still need to be tweaked on an individual basis. More data points however to mull over.

I'd like to see a database of members tunes to get a better overall prospective as I've found the car to be somewhat difficult to tune and the software a bit flaky. Certainly something to be gained by collective intelligence.

SAE the car made 323 rwhp which still isn't something to jump up and down about, but it's obvious the car has timing issues and may come around a tad more after getting a better handle on the car and more software refinement.

On a tangent...guys, that's better than a stock LS1. Think about it!!

Ya know, my feeling also. About time something good happened and what a great feeling it is to make real make progress vs watching things spin around you out of control.

interesting numbers. I'm surprised more so the difference between the two nismo cars. Also with less than 2000 miles on that motor I'm surprised it was more powerful than other higher mileage 370Zs.

Hi Alex! Thank you for the information.

I find it so funny that people who needed a "nice, long explanation about how I made no sense", specially those who claimed to have "balls" to flame me all of a sudden quiet, and haven't asked you a single question in regards to your post, ignoring your post... I guess its a shrinkage problem :roflpuke2:

Would be nice to hear from experts from this forum, on what they think about this particular Mustang Dyno @ Performance Motorsport.
Cause i thought it was the most accurate Dyno on the market? No?

If not, what other dynos would be recommended to go and get my car baselined on?

"Most accurate" will be 100% bias answer really.
Engine logics in Houston swears by their Dyno Dynamics as been the most accurate, where other shops you Dyno Jet. I believe Uprev in Austin uses Dyno Jet to do their tuning on, so in the end it really only matters for a base v. upgrade.

Really what the dyno is about is seeing your car progress, you want to find a good shop, with a solid dyno, giving accurate numbers consistently which you can use throughout the time you upgrade your car. This way you can track your car and know if there are any problems, issues, etc. by adding X part.

OK well... now i guess i am puzzled... why couldn't i have used my 330 whp run, that were consistent, to compare with my future modifications, without people getting all pissed of about it...?
I mean... yourself and other few people in the thread, have their whp noted in their signature. Is it 100% accurate?, probably not(as i learned today), yet people don't really say anything negative about it...

I am really confused now!
How do you find a solid dyno, giving accurate numbers consistently?
Does anyone know what is exact powerloss % due to drivetrain etc on stock 370z?

Not that this will solve or answer anything but here are my dyno results (prior to the Cobb AccessPORT) back in August. The first one was done 7 August @ Altered Atmosphere using their DynoJet:

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/n...-07Aug09-1.jpg

Now, just for sh*ts & giggles I had a dyno performed on 22 August on a DynoDynamics (aka "The Heartbreaker"):

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/n...cs-22Aug09.jpg

No changes were made to my car between the two results.....quite a difference, huh?

Assuming nothing is wrong with the dyno, then, yes, you can continually use it to track progress with your mods. But, (I'm not saying its 100% the reason) if that dyno is indeed giving inflated numbers, then you won't get a credible reading to track your progression and you will cheat yourself.

Instead of calling people "haters", just listen to what they have to say, you'll get farther in life.

Rob, i think you bring up a good point. Why does your 330 get flamed, but other WHPs on peoples signatures not call any attention. From what it seem (by the admission of many of the flamers) dynos cant really be used to give an absolute WHP. Its main use is to calculate WHP deltas. So your 330 in your sig is just as credible as somone's 2xx.

:roflpuke2: :bowrofl:

It may have something to do with the fact that they have spent lots of money to get to 330... and its upseting to see stock nismo show that number?... but then again... i wouldn't know anything about it...


I think i gotta go and DYNO my car at "heartbreaker" to please everyone :P
Why do i get a feeling that, base 370z owners are separating themself from Nismo owners? I mean overall its same car!
Except few badges, suspension, ecu, exhaust, cosmetics, interior, weight & body reinforcements...


I know... truth hurts!
I listen to people who get their point across without offending me for no reason!

Ill roll with you to heartbreaker, just give me some notice.

Now I cannot remember! I thought it was the Cayman S. Oh well...

You are SOOO correct about the MT test being Apples and oranges... That is one reason why I did not renew my MT subscription....

I just posted my two different ones just to show how different they can come out. I think its great that you got 330! 14K in upgrades for me and I'm still 15 whp behind ya. :p

OUCH!!!

Just wait until i break my motor in properly hahahahahahaha..... i don't think i will leave another day after those results

Some of us work you know?

Not posting for hours isnt going quiet, its being busy. I am not ignoring either one of your posts. You really want to get me going though right? Shrinkage problem? Listen, as easily as I could run you and this thread into the ground, I'm not going to because I know this all stems from you having more ego than you do experience on modding cars.

You seem to be missing the point still though so let me play nice again. Dynos are only as good as their ability to be consistent and give you a comparison by which to judge the efficiency of your engine and transmission. As in the actual numbers you produce vary from dyno to dyno because they are calibrated differently or just because they are in different shape from another dyno. Whats important is your ability to consistently figure out how much of a difference your modifications have made.

That is all true, but only within reason. If your car came out to 450whp (or 330 for that matter) five dyno pulls in a row, it doesn't make that dyno graph real. There has to be SOME continuity between dynos, don't you think? As in, well calibrated mustangdyne dynos should come out with relatively similar numbers, affected only by such things as wear, atmospheric conditions and the actual car (as some cars have more hp than others of the same car stock).

You made a comment about the veridity of my numbers? Let me explain to you that I started off with 256whp on a mustangdyne dyno. After doing similar bolt on mods than a lot of people did on this forums, I got very similar numbers (in fact somewhat lower) than they did on the same dynos in different places throughout the country. Also, I've got a little experience when it comes to cars. I know what 330whp feels like with a 3000lb car, a 3300lb car and a 3600lb car. I know I am a little under that for my car and so my numbers make sense for where I'm at. Go figure I can go a little faster than an e92 M3 on the straights at my local track..

So the point is, there has to be some continuity to the results. 330whp is something like 23% too high for your car on that dyno based on the consensus we've had since I joined this board. Just because the dyno says its true, it doesn't mean its true. Always take your results with a grain of salt. If you read my journal you will see that I was one of the first people who posted results for full bolt ons and that I was in disbelief about the results and the numbers I got. But then others with similar mods started making the same power on the same dyno's and it seems now that a full bolt on 370z is making around 310rwhp.

After seeing tons of 370Z's dyno on these forums, those of us who have been paying attention have been able to estimate the range of where stock cars fall for different dynos and where the different mods done to them fall on different dynos. After seeing the effects of different mods, we have also come to predict results for new mods that come out. Obviously its a new car and there are a lot of unknowns to us so far, but we know certain things already.

So you see the problem with coming in here and telling us you have 330whp on your stock Nismo and then arguing with us when we tell you that you don't. Do you see why its a little frustrating and some have even tried showing you you dont have 330whp using your quarter mile trap speed?

You make it seem like we are out on a crusade to shut you down and put you down when that is far from the case. We just hate to see someone bust in here thinking they know something we know isn't true and then arguing with us when we tell you its not true.

If you want to live in dreamland and claim you have 300whp+ and look like a complete idiot, then be my guest. It just seems it would've been a little easier to listen to us. Also you are going to have to get used to a little hazing, specially when you are new to the forum and when you are making wild claims that anyone with some experience know not to be true. Trust me that becomes apparent very quickly to those with more experience when someone else doesn't really have a full grasp of things yet.

As far as the accuracy of mustangs...they are excellent dyno's because they are consistent and accurate for comparing runs when you are doing tuning or have installed add-ons. They read lower than most other dynos, with the exception of the dyno dynamics sometimes. (which is another reason your numbers are silly). If you really have 330whp on a mustangdyne, then you should get something like 380whp on a dynapak....haha that would be nice for a stock 332bhp car.....

We might be a little rough at times, but we mean well. So instead of a fight, you get more info you ***.

EDIT: I just read your previous posts while I was writing mine and you are a clueless jackass.