Nissan 370Z Forum
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Nissan 370Z Forum (http://www.the370z.com/)
-   Brakes & Suspension (http://www.the370z.com/brakes-suspension/)
-   -   Just replaced my brake pads, now it sucks. (http://www.the370z.com/brakes-suspension/74394-just-replaced-my-brake-pads-now-sucks.html)

Bking 07-24-2013 05:30 PM
Just replaced my brake pads, now it sucks.
 
The service guy at Nissan told me I needed to replace the front brake pads. After the change I almost got into an accident because it took a long time for the brakes to stop my car. I thought maybe it's new and needs time to "break-in". After a full day of driving the response from the brakes seemed to have improved but it was not like before. Before the change I needed only to step on the brakes relatively lightly to stop my car, but now I need to step fairly hard to do so.

I called my service guy and he told me these "brembo" brakes takes some time to break-in and told me to go on a highway and hard brake a few times.

I feel like the brakes were not the problem but just the "sensitivity" of the brake pedal with the brakes themselves. Can the brakes be adjusted/calibrated?

Thanks in advance.

DEpointfive0 07-24-2013 05:48 PM
Kill him, you don't have Brembo's tell them to redo it and bleed your lines

kenchan 07-24-2013 06:10 PM
yah the stock pads needs to be bedded in, but unlike aftermarket it shouldn't need a full 50mph to 5mph break in. as DE noted, i think you got air in the system or fluid is low.

Nut_N_Much 07-24-2013 06:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2417404)
Kill him, you don't have Brembo's tell them to redo it and bleed your lines
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2417440)
yah the stock pads needs to be bedded in, but unlike aftermarket it shouldn't need a full 50mph to 5mph break in. as DE noted, i think you got air in the system or fluid is low.
:iagree: x2 Kill him after he bleeds your system.. :driving:

Bking 07-24-2013 07:42 PM
Thanks for the feedback guys! I will definitely tell him to do that, fix it, then kill him.

kenchan 07-24-2013 07:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2417586)
Thanks for the feedback guys! I will definitely tell him to do that, fix it, then kill him.
:icon18::tup:

/Angelo350Z/ 07-24-2013 10:00 PM
Why would he open the brake system (crack a line) if he just replaced the pads? What kind did you get? Certain pads just have more bite than others.

DEpointfive0 07-24-2013 10:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by /Angelo350Z/ (Post 2417809)
Why would he open the brake system (crack a line) if he just replaced the pads? What kind did you get? Certain pads just have more bite than others.
Release pressure to open up the caliper

/Angelo350Z/ 07-24-2013 10:16 PM
^^ Was that necessary? He could've just removed the reservoir cap, then carefully pried off the caliper. Once off, he could've pushed the pistons back using the old pad with a c-clamp.

But whatever. Apparently he decided to suck at his job instead.

synolimit 07-24-2013 11:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2417440)
yah the stock pads need to be bedded in, but unlike aftermarket it shouldn't need a full 50mph to 5mph break in. as DE noted, i think you got air in the system or fluid is low.
Umm this is incorrect. Stock pads need several 60-10 stops till fade; aftermarket pads need several too but then an additional 4 stops doing 80-10. This is per Stop tech and my own tech. My OEM pads stop on a freaking dime with what feels like about 1/2" pedal depression. My rotors have the beautiful gray color with pad material bedded in and same with my C300 (more pedal travel here though, need new stuff with 45k on the clock).

chrischhorn 07-25-2013 01:12 AM
I didnt break in my Project Mu pads and they feel amazing.......

Bking 07-25-2013 10:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by /Angelo350Z/ (Post 2417809)
Why would he open the brake system (crack a line) if he just replaced the pads? What kind did you get? Certain pads just have more bite than others.
I got the stock (sport?) brake pads that came with the Z. I won't be able to bring it back to the shop this week but definitely early next week. It just feels really weird to stop my car now, slowing the car down is relatively okay, though. Air inside the brake lines seems very probable. I will update this thread once it's fixed.

Sh0velMan 07-25-2013 10:54 AM
It's cute when people think the brakes with OEM pads are good. :)

Most ppl break their necks the first time they touch my brakes. Cost me a lot in personal injury suits.

kenchan 07-25-2013 11:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrischhorn (Post 2417962)
I didnt break in my Project Mu pads and they feel amazing.......
yep. i didnt have to do any special bedding in for my endless pads either.

not all pads require bedding like we do on high performance pads, although i still do it anyway to make myself feel better. :icon17:

kenchan 07-25-2013 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by synolimit (Post 2417906)
Umm this is incorrect. Stock pads need several 60-10 stops till fade; aftermarket pads need several too but then an additional 4 stops doing 80-10. This is per Stop tech and my own tech. My OEM pads stop on a freaking dime with what feels like about 1/2" pedal depression. My rotors have the beautiful gray color with pad material bedded in and same with my C300 (more pedal travel here though, need new stuff with 45k on the clock).
ummm good for you.

Voice59 07-25-2013 11:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2417359)
The service guy at Nissan told me I needed to replace the front brake pads. After the change I almost got into an accident because it took a long time for the brakes to stop my car. I thought maybe it's new and needs time to "break-in". After a full day of driving the response from the brakes seemed to have improved but it was not like before. Before the change I needed only to step on the brakes relatively lightly to stop my car, but now I need to step fairly hard to do so.

I called my service guy and he told me these "brembo" brakes takes some time to break-in and told me to go on a highway and hard brake a few times.

I feel like the brakes were not the problem but just the "sensitivity" of the brake pedal with the brakes themselves. Can the brakes be adjusted/calibrated?

Thanks in advance.
Same thing happened to me. Thing is I was there literally from start to finish and watched every part of the procedure. Including the bleeding, and they did it correctly on every wheel. Still I feel like the pedal is a whole lot softer.

kenchan 07-25-2013 11:36 AM
pad compound changed?

JARblue 07-25-2013 12:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by /Angelo350Z/ (Post 2417829)
But whatever. Apparently he decided to suck at his job instead.
:icon18: Yes. Yes he did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2418584)
yep. i didnt have to do any special bedding in for my endless pads either.

not all pads require bedding like we do on high performance pads, although i still do it anyway to make myself feel better. :icon17:
I think the EBC red stuff don't require bedding either. I wasn't able to bed my Hawk Performance Ceramics as precisely as I would have liked due to unexpected traffic at 9 pm, but they are fine and perform much better than the stock pads ever did.

My experience with bedding brakes
( Click to show/hide )
My understanding of the idea of bedding brakes is to get them good and hot to transfer an even layer of pad material to the rotor for proper operation. If you do this too quickly, the layer is likely to be uneven as the pad can quickly and suddenly increase the deposits when certain temperatures are reached (varying with different pads and other conditions). Therefore, you want to do lighter bedding at the beginning to gradually increase the level of deposit. And of course, you never want to engage ABS.

The experience that has worked best for me is starting with 2-3 runs braking from 50mph down to 20mph. Mash down on the brake pedal good, but you don't need to be close to kicking in ABS - just trying to heat them up gradually here. Next are the 60-10 runs, and these are the ones you want to be all in on the braking. Basically you want to brake as hard as possible without engaging ABS - error on the side of braking lighter as ABS will put marks on your rotors or worse, leave uneven spots of pad deposit if hot enough. I usually do 60-20, 60-15, 60-10, 60-5. The quicker you can do these, the hotter your rotors will get. If you can get the rotors good and hot, one good 80-10 will finish the job. I generally do 2-3 when I can't do the previous runs fast enough.

chrischhorn 07-25-2013 02:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JARblue (Post 2418644)
:icon18: Yes. Yes he did.



I think the EBC red stuff don't require bedding either. I wasn't able to bed my Hawk Performance Ceramics as precisely as I would have liked due to unexpected traffic at 9 pm, but they are fine and perform much better than the stock pads ever did.

My experience with bedding brakes
( Click to show/hide )
My understanding of the idea of bedding brakes is to get them good and hot to transfer an even layer of pad material to the rotor for proper operation. If you do this too quickly, the layer is likely to be uneven as the pad can quickly and suddenly increase the deposits when certain temperatures are reached (varying with different pads and other conditions). Therefore, you want to do lighter bedding at the beginning to gradually increase the level of deposit. And of course, you never want to engage ABS.

The experience that has worked best for me is starting with 2-3 runs braking from 50mph down to 20mph. Mash down on the brake pedal good, but you don't need to be close to kicking in ABS - just trying to heat them up gradually here. Next are the 60-10 runs, and these are the ones you want to be all in on the braking. Basically you want to brake as hard as possible without engaging ABS - error on the side of braking lighter as ABS will put marks on your rotors or worse, leave uneven spots of pad deposit if hot enough. I usually do 60-20, 60-15, 60-10, 60-5. The quicker you can do these, the hotter your rotors will get. If you can get the rotors good and hot, one good 80-10 will finish the job. I generally do 2-3 when I can't do the previous runs fast enough.

Not enough road in Hawaii to properly embed the brakes lol.

JARblue 07-25-2013 02:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrischhorn (Post 2418820)
Not enough road in Hawaii to properly embed the brakes lol.
:icon18: yeah... Texas has just little bit more real estate :icon17:

chrischhorn 07-25-2013 02:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JARblue (Post 2418835)
:icon18: yeah... Texas has just little bit more real estate :icon17:
I miss Texas......Almost been a year since I left. :(

kenchan 07-25-2013 02:57 PM
i have enough dumbarse drivers around my area just dodging them in regular traffic beds brakes nicely each time. :icon17:

/Angelo350Z/ 07-25-2013 07:19 PM
So is your car fixed OP? Did you kill him yet?

Mike 07-25-2013 08:12 PM
you just need to bed them properly. 10 stops, 50-0 in quick succession, let them cool and repeat. Maybe endless pads are prebedded, who knows, but most pads aren't. prebedded are available from carbotech, but its easy enough to bed them on my own.

even in Hawaii, you can get up to 50 and stop several times.

chrischhorn 07-25-2013 09:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike (Post 2419320)
you just need to bed them properly. 10 stops, 50-0 in quick succession, let them cool and repeat. Maybe endless pads are prebedded, who knows, but most pads aren't. prebedded are available from carbotech, but its easy enough to bed them on my own.

even in Hawaii, you can get up to 50 and stop several times.
Not without crossing a cop...... I swear there is more cops on this tiny *** island then in the state of Texas :shakes head:

DEpointfive0 07-25-2013 10:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrischhorn (Post 2419432)
Not without crossing a cop...... I swear there is more cops on this tiny *** island then in the state of Texas :shakes head:
AND they roam in the officers' personal cars... So you'll see them in 50 different cars...

chrischhorn 07-25-2013 11:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2419459)
AND they roam in the officers' personal cars... So you'll see them in 50 different cars...
Yup........my ticket came from a cop in a Toyota 4Runner. The only mark they have on them is the Blue light o top. Theres 2 slammed G35 sedan cop cars, 1 on 370z Sport wheels and another one some chrome big lipped wheels and those are their cop cars....

Bking 07-26-2013 12:20 PM
UPDATE: After I gave them a horrible survey from Nissan Canada, the service manager contacted me and basically apologized for not telling me that new brakes might take a while to break in, and nearly got me into an accident. And it is normal for new brakes to feel "spongy" in the beginning.

Anyhow, I brought my car in this morning and in 30 mins they told me nothing is wrong. The service manager test drove the car and told me the ABS came on so the brakes are mounted correctly. He told me it can take up to 400-500 km (around 275 miles for you southern folks) in order for the brakes to fully break in. I told him about air in the brake lines but he said they never touched the brake lines when changing the brake pad so that was not possible. Also he mentioned that since my car is "5 speed" I will tend to slow my car by downshifting rather than using my brakes. I told him I use SRM and/or shift to neutral all the time and it hardly slows my car down so that's irrelevant. Finally he told me to give it a week or two to see if there are improvements, if not just bring it back in.

Thoughts anyone?

Bking 07-26-2013 12:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by /Angelo350Z/ (Post 2419258)
So is your car fixed OP? Did you kill him yet?
No I haven't killed him yet. I will see in a week or two.

6MT 07-26-2013 01:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2417359)
The service guy at Nissan told me I needed to replace the front brake pads. After the change I almost got into an accident because it took a long time for the brakes to stop my car. I thought maybe it's new and needs time to "break-in". After a full day of driving the response from the brakes seemed to have improved but it was not like before. Before the change I needed only to step on the brakes relatively lightly to stop my car, but now I need to step fairly hard to do so.

I called my service guy and he told me these "brembo" brakes takes some time to break-in and told me to go on a highway and hard brake a few times.

I feel like the brakes were not the problem but just the "sensitivity" of the brake pedal with the brakes themselves. Can the brakes be adjusted/calibrated?

Thanks in advance.
Did they resurface the rotors? Or put new rotors on? The pads are really only half a brake job.... there's 2 surfaces involved.

kenchan 07-26-2013 01:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2420175)
UPDATE: I after I gave them a horrible survey from Nissan Canada, the service manager contacted me and basically apologized for not telling me that new brakes might take a while to break in, and nearly got me into an accident. And it is normal for new brakes to feel "spongy" in the beginning.

Anyhow, I brought my car in this morning and in 30 mins they told me nothing is wrong. The service manager test drove the car and told me the ABS came on so the brakes are mounted correctly. He told me it can take up to 400-500 km (around 275 miles for you southern folks) in order for the brakes to fully break in. I told him about air in the brake lines but he said they never touched the brake lines when changing the brake pad so that was not possible. Also he mentioned that since my car is "5 speed" I will tend to slow my car by downshifting rather than using my brakes. I told him I use SRM and/or shift to neutral all the time and it hardly slows my car down so that's irrelevant. Finally he told me to give it a week or two to see if there are improvements, if not just bring it back in.

Thoughts anyone?
my thoughts? = lol

who the hell has time to wait 275miles for brakes to break in? you almost crashed in less than 200ft. :icon17: it will only happen probably another 275-300 times. but that's normal. :ugh:

6MT 07-26-2013 01:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2417404)
Kill him, you don't have Brembo's tell them to redo it and bleed your lines
:iagree: Your brakes are made by Akebono for Nissan.

Bking 07-26-2013 02:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2420263)
my thoughts? = lol

who the hell has time to wait 275miles for brakes to break in? you almost crashed in less than 200ft. :icon17: it will only happen probably another 275-300 times. but that's normal. :ugh:
I would say I almost crashed in less than 20 ft. I was still inside the tiny-a$$ service parking lot trying to get out, and one of the mechanics driving in front of me hard braked for oncoming traffic and I almost (within 1 ft) rear-ended him.

DEpointfive0 07-26-2013 02:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2420175)
UPDATE: After I gave them a horrible survey from Nissan Canada, the service manager contacted me and basically apologized for not telling me that new brakes might take a while to break in, and nearly got me into an accident. And it is normal for new brakes to feel "spongy" in the beginning.

Anyhow, I brought my car in this morning and in 30 mins they told me nothing is wrong. The service manager test drove the car and told me the ABS came on so the brakes are mounted correctly. He told me it can take up to 400-500 km (around 275 miles for you southern folks) in order for the brakes to fully break in. I told him about air in the brake lines but he said they never touched the brake lines when changing the brake pad so that was not possible. Also he mentioned that since my car is "5 speed" I will tend to slow my car by downshifting rather than using my brakes. I told him I use SRM and/or shift to neutral all the time and it hardly slows my car down so that's irrelevant. Finally he told me to give it a week or two to see if there are improvements, if not just bring it back in.

Thoughts anyone?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2420333)
I would say I almost crashed in less than 20 ft. I was still inside the tiny-a$$ service parking lot trying to get out, and one of the mechanics driving in front of me hard braked for oncoming traffic and I almost (within 1 ft) rear-ended him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2420263)
my thoughts? = lol

who the hell has time to wait 275miles for brakes to break in? you almost crashed in less than 200ft. :icon17: it will only happen probably another 275-300 times. but that's normal. :ugh:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2420180)
No I haven't killed him yet. I will see in a week or two.
Again, KILL HIM... Tell them to fuck off and redo it
Don't half ass their fuck up... Isn't the bedding in supposed to be done by the tech when he takes it for a test?

kenchan 07-26-2013 02:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2420333)
I would say I almost crashed in less than 20 ft. I was still inside the tiny-a$$ service parking lot trying to get out, and one of the mechanics driving in front of me hard braked for oncoming traffic and I almost (within 1 ft) rear-ended him.
oh so i will only happen like another 2500x. :icon17:

i would do the bedding procedure then. 50mph to 5mph if you have an open road. maybe find an exit ramp that's not too busy and brake hard off into the shoulder. do that 3-4 times and let the brakes cool.

Bking 07-26-2013 03:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEpointfive0 (Post 2420351)
Again, KILL HIM... Tell them to fuck off and redo it
Don't half ass their fuck up... Isn't the bedding in supposed to be done by the tech when he takes it for a test?
I kinda gave up. I mean the brake works and all but just doesn't feel the same anymore. Meh, I guess I'm stuck with this until I sell the car in the future.

kenchan 07-26-2013 03:16 PM
i guess if it still sucks after the bedding procedure, get some aftermarket pads installed? :)

having good brakes was part of my buying decision for my Z, so i'd definitely fix that until im satisfied again.

JARblue 07-26-2013 03:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bking (Post 2420433)
I kinda gave up. I mean the brake works and all but just doesn't feel the same anymore. Meh, I guess I'm stuck with this until I sell the car in the future.
You don't have to use the crappy stock pads :ugh2:

Get some aftermarket pads and bed them yourself. A good budget solution for DD applications is the Centric Posi-Quiet pads :tiphat:

kenchan 07-26-2013 03:37 PM
im kinda wanting to try the project mu pads when my stock pads are done.

XwChriswX 07-26-2013 03:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kenchan (Post 2420504)
im kinda wanting to try the project mu pads when my stock pads are done.
When I took off my stock pads at 32k, they still looked brand new. I guess they are made for seriously long life, so you'll be waiting for a while.


Unless you're an uberbraker... :icon17:


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