Akebonos not up to heavy track use!

rbratton · 10-20-2009, 10:56 PM

I ran at Little Talladega last month with Carbotech XP10/8 combination. I was still using stock brake fluid, but my only problem was the bleeder screw on the left front caliper outside slightly loosened and leaked a bit. Luckily the brake paddle gradually softened and I was smart enough to pit in and check it out. I too was hitting around 110 on the straight and braking extremely late. Compared to my 350Z, I was pretty impressed with the brakes. Little Talladega is definately harder on brakes than most of the tracks I've been too thus far. This weekend, I'm heading to Putnam Park. I've upgrade brake fluid to Motul and I'll have 275 width tires on the front for a few runs. This should be a good test of the brakes...

Mike · 10-21-2009, 08:36 AM

Where is Putnam Park? I think I've heard the name before, but not sure.

btw,
the new brembos proved to be excellent at CMP last weekend.

370Zsteve · 10-21-2009, 08:37 AM

Doesn't Akebono make brakes for F1 cars, wtf?

import111 · 10-21-2009, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 370Zsteve

Doesn't Akebono make brakes for F1 cars, wtf?

As far as I know, Brembo, Carbon industry, and Hitco (or Hitko) are the 3 brake makers for F1.

370Zsteve · 10-21-2009, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by import111

As far as I know, Brembo, Carbon industry, and Hitco (or Hitko) are the 3 brake makers for F1.

Martin Whitmarsh, CEO Formula One, Vodafone McLaren Mercedes:

"We are immensely proud of this partnership with Akebono, who join our World Class group of partners and suppliers. Vodafone McLaren Mercedes prides itself on forging technical collaborations with the best organisations in the World by integrating leading-edge technology into our race cars. Akebono has proven its capability to deliver increased performance and has contributed greatly to Vodafone McLaren Mercedes’ Grand Prix wins this season so far. We are looking forward to further developing technologies with a long-term relationship with Akebono."

import111 · 10-21-2009, 10:38 AM

Wow, 1st I have heard of that. Looks like there are 4 brake suppliers in F1.

I have a track day on the 31st...my 1st track day in the Z. I am very hard on brakes so I will soon find out how well these brakes can hold up. Motul RBF600 fluid and Carbotech XP-10's are the only brake mods for the track thus far.

Mike · 10-21-2009, 03:54 PM

check your pads after the track day too. I just switched to ferodo DS2500s in the rear to match what came with the front brembos and in 2 and a half days at CMP they were pretty much to the backing plate. I've never seen a car eat through rear pads so fast.

alan93rsa · 10-21-2009, 10:10 PM

Quote:

This weekend, I'm heading to Putnam Park. I've upgrade brake fluid to Motul and I'll have 275 width tires on the front for a few runs. This should be a good test of the brakes.

Putnam is East of Indianapolis, IN. Turn 7 will test your brakes.

To the question on brake seals: I have never found any that last with hard track use. The seals on Porsche/Brembo Big Reds never lasted more than a few weekends. Keep a can of brake clean and clean the pistons BEFORE you retract them at pad change time. That should keep the bores clean.

370Zsteve · 10-22-2009, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by import111

Wow, 1st I have heard of that. Looks like there are 4 brake suppliers in F1.

I have a track day on the 31st...my 1st track day in the Z. I am very hard on brakes so I will soon find out how well these brakes can hold up. Motul RBF600 fluid and Carbotech XP-10's are the only brake mods for the track thus far.

Surprised me too, although I think they've been supplying McLaren for the past 2 seasons

My point is that I'm surprised they're performing so poorly..........

import111 · 10-22-2009, 02:09 PM

Well, so far there is only 1 person that has posted this issue, and from what it looks like it is just the dust boots that were damaged, which is not a big deal. My STi's Brembos dust boots were very cracked after a few track days and I never had issues 10 track days later.

rbratton · 10-22-2009, 03:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike

Where is Putnam Park? I think I've heard the name before, but not sure.

btw,
the new brembos proved to be excellent at CMP last weekend.

It's near Terra Haute, Indiana. It's similar to talladega but a bit longer at 1.7 miles.

AP - Chris_B · 10-22-2009, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by import111

As far as I know, Brembo, Carbon industry, and Hitco (or Hitko) are the 3 brake makers for F1.

AP Racing supplies more F1 teams than anyone else. SGL/Hitco and Carbone Industries supply the carbon-carbon discs and pads, but AP Racing or Brembo supply special calipers and engineering support to all but one team based on the latest information that I have.

Akebono bought the Williams deal, much to the disappointment of the team's engineering staff. AP Racing had been the supplier, but they do not sponsor anybody in any series (which is interesting, since they supply the dominating calipers -- the RadiCal line -- in NASCAR these days, a series that is all about sponsorship!). If you remember the financial hot water that Williams got themselves into in 2007 ($100M worth), you can easily understand the changes they needed to make in order to stay afloat.

All that said, Akebono's F1 calipers have absolutely nothing to do with the design and manufacturing efforts for their OE programs. In this particular case, the G/Z Sport calipers are for primarily for looks.

Chris

370Zsteve · 10-22-2009, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AP - Chris_B

AP Racing supplies more F1 teams than anyone else. SGL/Hitco and Carbone Industries supply the carbon-carbon discs and pads, but AP Racing or Brembo supply special calipers and engineering support to all but one team based on the latest information that I have.

Akebono bought the Williams deal, much to the disappointment of the team's engineering staff. AP Racing had been the supplier, but they do not sponsor anybody in any series (which is interesting, since they supply the dominating calipers -- the RadiCal line -- in NASCAR these days, a series that is all about sponsorship!). If you remember the financial hot water that Williams got themselves into in 2007 ($100M worth), you can easily understand the changes they needed to make in order to stay afloat.

All that said, Akebono's F1 calipers have absolutely nothing to do with the design and manufacturing efforts for their OE programs. In this particular case, the G/Z Sport calipers are for primarily for looks.

Chris

Really? Akebono derives NOTHING for OEM products from racing? Really?

Race on Sunday, win on Monday?. I'm probably talking out my azz here, but it sounds weird, wtf.

Sharif@Forged · 10-25-2009, 09:18 PM

CMP and TGP are two of the toughest tracks on brakes. They just eat up pads, rotors, and everything else. If your brakes hold up well at these two tracks, they will have no problem at Road Atlanta, VIR, Barber, Roebling...etc..etc.

There are only a handful of brake upgrades I would use on track, and Brembo and AP, and Stop Tech are three of them.

rbratton · 10-26-2009, 02:26 PM

Carbotech XP10/8 combo with stock brakes worked great at Putnam Park this weekend. I had 275 tires up front and they still held up fine. I did however hit limp mode even with an oil cooler installed.

10-21-2009, 08:36 AM	#17 (permalink)
Mike The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Loganville, GA Posts: 5,944 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 2187	Where is Putnam Park? I think I've heard the name before, but not sure. btw, the new brembos proved to be excellent at CMP last weekend. __________________ NISSAN: 75 280Z / 86 300ZX GLL /87 Sentra SE / 03 350Z / 23 Z Porsche: 93 968 / 23 Macan GTS / 93 968

10-21-2009, 08:37 AM	#18 (permalink)
370Zsteve A True Z Fanatic Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Gold Coast CT Posts: 10,599 Drives: 2019 Corvette G.S. Rep Power: 43	Doesn't Akebono make brakes for F1 cars, wtf? __________________ SOLD MY Z MARCH 2018 - another Core OG moves on - new ride 2019 Z Corvette Grand Sport - no mods necessary but already have eyes on HFC and intakes LOL IT NEVER ENDS.

10-21-2009, 03:54 PM	#22 (permalink)
Mike The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Loganville, GA Posts: 5,944 Drives: 370z Rep Power: 2187	check your pads after the track day too. I just switched to ferodo DS2500s in the rear to match what came with the front brembos and in 2 and a half days at CMP they were pretty much to the backing plate. I've never seen a car eat through rear pads so fast. __________________ NISSAN: 75 280Z / 86 300ZX GLL /87 Sentra SE / 03 350Z / 23 Z Porsche: 93 968 / 23 Macan GTS / 93 968

10-25-2009, 09:18 PM	#29 (permalink)
Sharif@Forged The370Z.com Sponsor Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Marietta, GA Posts: 840 Drives: 2009 GT-R, 2010 370Z Rep Power: 18	CMP and TGP are two of the toughest tracks on brakes. They just eat up pads, rotors, and everything else. If your brakes hold up well at these two tracks, they will have no problem at Road Atlanta, VIR, Barber, Roebling...etc..etc. There are only a handful of brake upgrades I would use on track, and Brembo and AP, and Stop Tech are three of them. __________________ Sharif@Forgedperformance.com General Manager/Certified Tuner/NASA-PCA-BMWCAA Instructor JRZ RS1's Available NOW...PM me Cobb ProTuner, Uprev ECU Flash, FCON Vpro, Haltech, Motec Certified

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10-20-2009, 10:56 PM	#16 (permalink)
rbratton Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Vine Grove, KY Posts: 89 Drives: 2009 370Z Rep Power: 17	I ran at Little Talladega last month with Carbotech XP10/8 combination. I was still using stock brake fluid, but my only problem was the bleeder screw on the left front caliper outside slightly loosened and leaked a bit. Luckily the brake paddle gradually softened and I was smart enough to pit in and check it out. I too was hitting around 110 on the straight and braking extremely late. Compared to my 350Z, I was pretty impressed with the brakes. Little Talladega is definately harder on brakes than most of the tracks I've been too thus far. This weekend, I'm heading to Putnam Park. I've upgrade brake fluid to Motul and I'll have 275 width tires on the front for a few runs. This should be a good test of the brakes...

10-21-2009, 10:38 AM	#21 (permalink)
import111 Track Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ. Posts: 622 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Rep Power: 192	Wow, 1st I have heard of that. Looks like there are 4 brake suppliers in F1. I have a track day on the 31st...my 1st track day in the Z. I am very hard on brakes so I will soon find out how well these brakes can hold up. Motul RBF600 fluid and Carbotech XP-10's are the only brake mods for the track thus far.

10-22-2009, 02:09 PM	#25 (permalink)
import111 Track Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ. Posts: 622 Drives: 09 Nissan 370Z Rep Power: 192	Well, so far there is only 1 person that has posted this issue, and from what it looks like it is just the dust boots that were damaged, which is not a big deal. My STi's Brembos dust boots were very cracked after a few track days and I never had issues 10 track days later.

10-26-2009, 02:26 PM	#30 (permalink)
rbratton Base Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Vine Grove, KY Posts: 89 Drives: 2009 370Z Rep Power: 17	Carbotech XP10/8 combo with stock brakes worked great at Putnam Park this weekend. I had 275 tires up front and they still held up fine. I did however hit limp mode even with an oil cooler installed.