Originally Posted by RicerX

Very isolated perspective you have.

I'm making my final diatribe in this thread. Stamping it done for me. I have pretty much moved on from the idea of a new Z and here's why:

When looking at this from a feasible business case perspective, the Z is a very usable car for an extremely small subset of the American car market. To that subset, yes you can pack for the beach for a week with your wife and rock out. I have done the same thing. I also had a Mazdaspeed3 hatchback at home for when I needed to haul drums, hockey gear, or a decent run at costco. I did those things far more frequently than I went to the beach (sadly, but realistically.) For the overwhelming majority of Americans, a two seater for $35k cannot do "life" like a $35k full sized truck or crossover can. Also, for that majority, their budgets only allow them to pick one.

That makes the Z a niche car even before you get to the sports car part (I mean, a Fiat 500 is basically a 2 seater and we won't dare call that rolling piece of Dots candy a sports car, do we?). In order for Nissan to have a case to produce one (skipping the whole "needing a market of buyers" part), it needs to engineer as few new parts as possible to keep the costs down. This is why even the 350Z (This is a car that sold abundantly well in comparison to the 370, by the way) still shared many components with other cars to maintain potential profitability (the G35 being the biggest share, which was Infiniti's best selling model throughout its entire lifecycle). So we share it with the new Q60 platform as an option (which is a rinse and repeat move, but the most likely one if they do it). However, while this is the most likely option, it is not without its fair share of problems.

The VR motor is there for the picking SHOULD NISSAN DECIDE that it's ok to potentially dilute/endanger Infiniti sales. Infiniti is finally on the upswing (a brand that was in dire jeopardy of being killed off by CEO Ghosn in 2011), and sharing engines that have been dubbed "brand exclusive" (see: Red Sport press release) jeopardizes that growth in a way that the Infiniti brand cannot afford. The only VR that can be brought over without encroaching upon the whole exclusivity thing is the 300hp version. This brings many problems, not least of which includes the marketing problem you create by bringing an "ALL NEW IMPROVED Z" with "less power" than the outgoing model. Less power is ok if you go less weight though, right?

The Q60 Red Sport is 3800-4000 pounds depending on equipment. You pull a "Rogue Sport/Qashqai vs Rogue" approach, and shorten the length without shortening the wheelbase and get a Z package from the Q60. That gets you to 3500 pounds at best, given the required safety features and such in order to sell the things in America. It checks a lot of required boxes for the car, except one glaring problem - there's no manual transmission built for it yet. So you have to make one, or alienate 55% of potential legacy Z buyers that you're looking to capture (the take rate on manuals over automatics varied between 50-60% throughout the 370Zs lifecycle to date). With the torque output of the VR motor, can the current 370Z transmission, CSC and all, hold up to that? That remains to be seen. But even though a manual transmission can be had in a Q50 (european diesel model only), was the Q60 built in such a way that a manual transmission simply cannot be equipped without extensive retooling? Given Infiniti's direction of being techy and futuristic in their packaging approach, this is more likely than not. Remember, this is a company whose engineers are working on engineering out the steering columns from their models.

Finally - to your desired set of features in the next gen Z, we come to the final problem. The most likely scenario is to take as much from a $55k Infiniti Coupe, and find a way to update the feature set of the car not even exhaustively found in the current $45k 370Z NISMO, and find a way to make all of that happen without getting to the $55k number of the Infiniti.

NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. The current 370Z NISMO is the best you are going to get.

Taking all of these accounting challenges into... *ahem*... account (they aren't engineering challenges - we have seen what Nissan is capable of pulling off in the GT-R without holding money to the highest priority) and coupling them with the direction Nissan is taking as a brand, it just isn't going to happen. Nissan won't do it. There are two recently executed pure living sheetmetal examples of the end result of Nissan's ability to "push the envelope" in a sporty car, and thy names are "Maxima" and "Sentra NISMO".

These cars are the result of capitulating to the nagging desires of an enthusiast working on a project while "playing it safe" and keeping the bottom line in the black instead of taking a chance (from a monetary and design standpoint) and building something exciting. The Maxima was supposed to be different than an Altima, and it's not. The Sentra NISMO was supposed to be the answer to a Focus ST or Subaru WRX, and instead it's a baseline Nissan Juke powertrain in a Sentra with red stripes on the outside. (The only reason why a manual is in that car is because they have already built it - plug and play - platform to platform).

When Andy Palmer left Nissan for Aston Martin, I truly knew it was over... I just didn't want to admit it. He was the last ranking car guy left in that company. Before he left, there were insiders I was talking that spoke of a 450hp version of what eventually came to be the VR Red Sport motor in the Infinitis for the next gen Z. There was the iDX concept.

Now look at what's happened to Nissan since he has left - more flavors of CVT-driven crossovers, a new light-heavyweight full size truck, a non-revolutionary "revolutionary" flagship sedan, a six-year-old SUV from Infiniti, and two 10-year-old sports cars.

What's Andy Palmer doing? He's busy giving the middle finger to the "reduce displacement and add boost for efficiency" mantra that even Porsche is now adopting, and stuffing giant N/A V12s into flagship GT Sports Cars (see: V12 Vanquish S) with THREE PEDALS available. Yeah, Aston is also building a crossover (I get it, you need a "volume" seller to make the R&D easier to absorb, but at least they're building exciting cool ****), but you can see a guy at the top is able to influence what is built, and that influence is executed from his vision for his company. Palmer's vision is exciting, elegant performance cars. Ghosn's vision is one of pure utility and economy for transportation itself (autonomy and energy independent), and perhaps it's the right one for a volume carmaker.

Ghosn was hired with the task of making Nissan profitable again. He's done that in spades. Nissan is a money-making machine. The man propped up Nissan, used Nissan to prop up Renault, and is about to prop up Mitsubishi. How they've done it and continue to do that is with a portfolio of products that exude a philosophy that doesn't mesh with cars like 370Zs and GT-Rs.

I would rather see the Z die quietly than become a part of that philosophy.

Even Kia has a better idea of what a sport sedan should be these days, if that puts things into better perspective for you. Go look at the new Stinger and tell me if the Maxima holds even a dim candle to it.