Cracked ADV1 wheels
 

When you look at buying wheels generally the more you spend the safer you should be or you think....ADV1 has not had the best track record from what I've witnessed and am just passing the info along. Its a good reminder to do research on things like wheels which are so critical to your safety.

I know most of you guys run Volks and what not it is always good to be informed.

Read here:
http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=664569

EDIT for adding info as i read the thread.

Claim for TUV approval

How to find out if the company is truly TUV approved

TUV Defined and TUV links

This is my post, as in im not posting for any companies, just posting this stuff so you guys and gals can get the best knowledge.

I dont want to see this happen here or to anywhere else.

I've said this before but I would stick with a brand that's been making wheels forever. I wouldn't buy from a wheel company that's been around for a few years, even if they sold forged wheels.

I agree infinitely, but in the end there are people that will.

OP updated to include more information.

I believe the owner of ADV1 is one of the former owners of 360forged which had many issues at the time.

Luckily ADV1 is priced out of my reach anyway so it won't matter. My buddys M6 has had nothing but issues with his 360 forged split 7 wheels.

However, I won't go with Volks again since last time, I purchased a 2 piece wheel, when the barrel got slightly damaged, I was wanting to order it, found out you are forced to order the entire wheel.

Have bought 2 and 3 piece wheels in the past, for looks and part replacement from damage, no reason I would have bought the Volk SF Challenge 2 piece if you can't replace an individual part.

Volk wheels are great, but after my last debacle, I will not be going with them again. there was no benefit to buying the expensive Volk 2 piece wheels. They looked great but were heavy and with repalcement issues.

Sounds like a Rota but more pricey.....:)

Most of the Volk 2 and 3-piece wheels are not modular since the centers are typically welded to barrels to prevent air leaks. However, in most situations where they're bent, you can repair them relatively easily.

Hard to blame one manufacturer when three different manufacturers are used to make one wheel...

Just my two cents.

This is why we only sell wheels that are tested and pass JWL and VIA standard. I guess having good marketing website and pictures allow them to sell their wheels at a higher price.

I believe ADV1 are more expensive then forged RAYs and WORK.

This is very very dangerous thing we are talking about here.

The ADV1's are priced "much" higher than Rays and Work. They do make some great looking wheels and definitely have marketed them well to very high end customers. Hope they get their issues ironed out.

ADV.1s are in HRE levels of cost. They're very, VERY expensive. At least HRE you get one hell of a wheel with a lot of history. ADV.1 is relatively new. That's all.

I'm quite happy with my Rays, thank you very much.

(edited to clarify position. Not slamming ADV.1 or trying to do so)

Thanks for posting this information! It should not be taken lightly.

We sell TONS of ADV.1 wheels, and this is the 1st problem I've seen. Every wheel has it's limits; I'd like to know exactly how this one was cracked.

What I'm trying to say, is let's wait for more failures before we condemn ADV.1. I've seen photos of cracked RAYS wheels too. The thing is, I've never seen a RAYS wheel crack from NORMAL use, so that may be the case here.

I'd just like to clarify a few things...

1. The actual cause of the failure (page 10) and what actually happened.
2. What we're doing to fix it and how we're taking care of the customer (page 10)
3. Pertaining to TUV - We are certified and the final paperwork to be included into their online database was submitted two weeks ago. However, we only officially TUV certify our German orders that require them... for reasons why, see here: BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92) - View Single Post - This is why I will only buy JWL certified wheels.

Thank you gents!

@ Matt

I got 2 questions.

BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92) - View Single Post - This is why I will only buy JWL certified wheels.
But in this post dated 2/20/2012, you stated you were TUV approved the week before, yet ADV cannot be found on any TUV databases.

BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92) - View Single Post - 22'' ADV10TS wheels cracked from the inside out!
And on this post, someone asks you if Tom Van Ryn, head engineer, was even really a certified engineer. Is he?

memorylasts -

Thank you for the questions!

On the TUV - we had the certificates signed 2 weeks ago when our German dealer was in town (ADV.1 Now Official TUV Registered Manufacturer | ADV.1 Blog). So the testing, paperwork, contracts, etc are all signed and approved. But the delay from our dealer getting back to Germany, submitting the paperwork to TUV, and having the documentation included into their database appears to take awhile.

It makes no sense for us to lie about TUV, knowing each thread about this is getting indexed in google for years to come. We fully expect you to be able to search on TUV.com soon to find us registered there. We just have no control on their internal process for adding things into their database.

About our Engineer - he has a full engineering degree. We don't just find any bum on craigslist to come in and engineer for us. Tom originally engineered for MHT and we just hired him on full time from MHT. We just wanted to stop directly replying to everyone's comments as it seem to just add fuel to the fire and in doing so it left the person in question searching for a conspiracy.

Hope that answers your questions!

@ Matt it does to some extent, but there are still some empty bits I feel you guys are avoiding. So for example HRE has a TUV Registration ID number, you guys are claiming to be TUV approved, so with that being said can you as a representative provide legitimate proof to this claim, you guys are passing it along as if it were true with no proof. Yes, it might not be an end all for you as a business and maybe you really dont care, you do to some extent, Im not a registered user on the m3post I do however spend time on the board. This little bit of legitimate proof would help you guys out a lot. However since it has been avoided and just covered by blanket statements people will believe it to not be true even though you have a claim to this thrown you dont belong.

Maybe with the belief of if enough people say it, that this certification would be factual?

every wheel company is going to run into issues like this sooner or later. I've seen damaged wheels from all brands but I think it's how a company deals with it and how they make it right as what really matters. There is no such thing as an invincible wheel

Even HRE has problems... just google "HRE Banned" and you'll see that their 3 piece wheels have been banned from many tracks as well as the brand itself being banned from numerous forums and look how respected they are as a company.

How many cracked or broken rotas and XXRs and other knock off wheels have we seen all over the forums, facebook and the internet in general yet people are still buying them because it "fits their budget"

BMW M3 Forum (E90 E92) - View Single Post - 22'' ADV10TS wheels cracked from the inside out!
There is no such ban, was all a rumor spread by a disgruntled customer. HRE is also NOT banned from ANY forums.

ADV1 is banned from ALL "Internet Brands" forums including 6speedonline, MBworld.org, etc.

ADV1's are not budget wheels.

We also consulted our wheels supplier and was told that in Japan most wheels designed for truck required a special "JWL-T" standard.

Some of the wheels passed "JWL", but can't passed "JWL-T", thus restrict from selling to trucks. "JWL-T" required strength test on heavier vehicle. 3000 lbs cars vs 8000 lbs truck.

Wondering if similar test are performed ?

Understood - We've got all the certifications (that's what we announced after we signed all the papers...) we didn't just fly our Dealer in from Germany for fun > ADV.1 Now Official TUV Registered Manufacturer | ADV.1 Blog

And take pictures of them physically testing the wheels at TUV > ADV.1 Progresses in TUV Certification | ADV.1 Blog

And here is a screen capture of one of the testing documents (all in German obviously) but the entire thing is over 10 pages PER wheel all in German. but as I stated we've got everything in order and submitted - we just haven't been issue the registration number as it's essentially the last step in the process once you've been added into their database.

Hope this helps!

I really don't see this thread ending well.

I would never buy 22" wheels, no matter who the manufacturer is though....

so was this a fatigue fracture? root cause?

:iagree: those have no reason to be on a performance car IMO. but to each their own.

lots of arguments over TUV certification and whatnot. i like ken would love to know what the root cause for the failure was. the paperwork gives me piece of mind, surely, but as was mentioned previously rays wheels aren't exactly bulletproof either. they're just known to be really, really reliable in typical situations. these could have been through hell or something. i dunno.

I hadn't looked at the links earlier but just did glance at the first one.

http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/3640/adv1l.jpg

I had originally thought that there was damage from hitting a bump, which would most likely damage the tire and the barrel first. Then possibly damage the hub/spoke. However this is completely different..... This wheel was "barely" holding on.... like a finger still attached by a small piece of skin. Glad the guy and his family didn't have it come off completely at highway speeds.

But I will say that after all the bashing, hating, and everything else that was put into the bmw thread, this response was good from ADV1. This was done with class.....

LINK

Response:
I am posting this on behalf of Jordan as he does not have a M3Post username.



Guys, I appreciate everyone's concern in this matter and you all are absolutely correct in saying that this is a major issue that is absolutely unacceptable. My own wife drives around every single day with the same 22" Step Lip rim halves along with my 4 year old and 1 year old baby boys in the back seat. Nothing in the world other than my family matters to and I'm sure that most of you feel exactly the same way. With that being said I was obviously very concerned when I first heard about the issue which was in mid 2011 on order number 1897, 22" ADV08 Track Spec's for a Mercedes ML63 AMG. At that time, the issue had never been seen and obviously we discussed the cause in detail with Mike at Triangle, our engineer, and multiple others to identify the issue and ensure that it's not repeated. At that time, the final verdict from Mike at Triangle was that the issue was due to an issue related to machining / engineering and not the inner barrel. Regardless we obviously checked every last detail on the file and physically checked the center discs themselves to confirm that this was the case which we actually had hoped it was as this is something internal that we can identify and correct ourselves and easily see if any other sets shared the issue. After doing so, we were unable to verify that this was the case as everything was exactly as it should have been. Mike then, replaced the parts for us at no cost, we finished and assembled the set with new hardware as always and advised our dealer of the issue in detail as they explained previously that the vehicle was driven aggressively and could have potentially been the cause in which case moving forward they would be driving under only normal conditions and would report to us if any problems occurred. At the time, no one really knew what the cause was so it was up in the air with possible causes ranging from chrome plating to improper use and several others. Mike did provide us with a detailed statement outlining what was his opinion on the cause which nowaym3 is referring to as he most likely was working at Triangle at the time and was aware of this. Regardless, what he or she is saying is true and was the case at that time.


Moving forward a few months, after keeping tabs on the first issue on the ML63 set and confirming that the issue seemed to have been solved we basically had nothing else to review as there was no final confirmation as to what caused the issue and no identifiable reasons to change anything moving forward as everything was engineered to spec and physically confirmed. I can assure you guys, even though many of you seem to have a preconceived opinion about me which is perfectly ok however this business isn't made for short term success, my own family and the families of nearly 20 of our staff depend on this company and treat it like their own. With this being said, ignoring an issue like this which could potentially cause a huge impact on any company if not resolved it was in not only my own interest to make sure that it's not going to happen again but everyone on ADV.1 staff, Triangle staff and MHT's staff. These are not issues that are ignored and had it been something that potentially could have recurred all parties involved would have stopped production on the affected parts until the issue was resolved. Many of you make comments as if we build all of our wheels with no regard to safety or quality which as you all know if were true we wouldn't be in business right now. Some of those who seem eager to offer their expertise on this matter jump at the opportunity to point out such an issue, although we all appreciate the information it's obvious that pointing this information out is in their best interest. Once again, perfectly fine - nothing we haven't dealt with in the past. I can see how something like this would be amazing news to any of our competitors unfortunately, but not surprisingly.

Had this been the end of the issue, the statements made by nowaym3 may have been valid however this person may not be involved with the more recent activity in this matter which arose in 2012. Order 2169, ordered for a BMW x6M in 22" ADV5.0 Track Spec configuration was reported to have the same issue. Upon learning about this issue personally on Feb 13, 2012 I contacted the client directly to get the details, apologize and get this issue resolved once and for all. I immediately had the wheels picked up and shipped to our facility in CA. I booked a flight the same day and was in the shop to inspect them once they arrived. At that time myself and some of our production related staff took the wheels to Mike ourselves in order to resolve and identify the issue once and for all. Around the same time, this particular order in question (1797) was also reported and was discussed. By that time it was clear that there were no issues with the center discs themselves, no engineering similarities that could have linked the 3 sets to the issue, they were used in different widths and offsets from low to high and on 3 different vehicles so all signs pointed to the one possible factor that they all had in common which was the inner barrel, all of which was the same size (22x7.5 and 22x8 inners) all 3 orders were confirmed to have these inners delivered around the same time frame and Mike himself confirmed that these parts were an older style step lip which was no longer used and also was a possible batch of parts which may have been outsourced to another vendor for the heat treating process which was not the usual protocol for reasons I'm not aware of.


With this all being said, the issues are clearly apparent. They are identified, isolated and resolved. The issue is clearly an unforeseen case of only 12 parts out of literally thousands that have been used not only by ADV.1 but by any 3 piece wheel manufacturer who buys 22" step lip parts. We will continue to support Triangle and work with them on a daily basis not only to improve but also because those who know are well aware that there are no better parts that can be found anywhere in the world and this is why we use them as do other high quality wheel brands.


In regards to Eugene's issues with communication and service from ADV.1, I have no argument here. I completely agree with you and apologize for this and I assure you the issue has not gone unnoticed and the sales rep involved has also expressed his apologies. Regardless, you're right and had I been aware of the issue directly I would have been extremely involved personally as I was and still am on the other 2 cases which both customers can confirm I'm sure. In any case, it doesn't matter at this point - you're not satisfied with your service and there's nothing more to it. All I can do is offer you one of 2 things should you wish to accept, one being a full refund on these wheels which you may choose to keep them if you would like or leave them here, either way is ok or alternatively although I doubt you'd like to have another set of our wheels due to the circumstance, I will offer you a free set of your choice - applicable to any car, any style, any finish, any time.

- Jordan

I would buy from them. Looks like they are taking care of the issues

Ugh, I don't know why but I read the whole thing on the other forums. I am so glad the Z forum isn't like that one lol. It's hell to climb uphill when one rep screws it up from the beginning though. I feel their pain. It seems they are doing whatever they can to fix things though.

I would buy a set. Just not in 22" for the 370Z. Issue handled with Class I must say.