Safety seat and belt question?
 

Everyone think this is ok???

OMP fiberglass FIA halo seat.
OMP 6 point FIA belt with 2" shoulder straps for Hans device.
Hans III device.
OMP belt came with 8.8 ring hardware and one ring is to the OEM seat belt hole, seconds to Planted base spot, and submarine belts use 2" x 1.5" x 3/16" steel plate on top and 2" x 4" x 3/16" steel plate on bottom.
10.9 hardware holding seat to raisers and base.
Planted FIA steel base with OEM bolts to chassis.
Planted FIA aluminium raisers.

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...pstibtkaxb.jpg

HANS

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...psmqsafewc.jpg

No HANS

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...psj7v2niqr.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...psvlss9e6d.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...psgnycklmg.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...psvyssyva3.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...psm8k59pby.jpg

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e1...psr8arwyri.jpg

All good mate, meets FIA minimums. My only suggestion (speaking from experience) is to use a carbon fibre seat because in a rear impact, a fibreglass seat WILL break where it transitions from horizontal sides at the base to rib-cage wrap-around for the seat back (I broke 3 ribs in just such an incident back in the noughties which was a right PITA).

I went with a carbon seat and ali-plate back stay behind the seat-back with 1" hi-density foam cushioning.

I am talking a full-on ProdSports car but of you want maximum protection, that is it

Hmm interesting. Well the seat is a 2015. Im hoping technology has gotten better.

Only thing im worried about right now is the shoulder straps. Right now they are just tied to the OEM rear bar. Its only there so i can drive to the cage builder. What worries me though is when im fully strapped in and bend my head forward with the HANS installed the belts slide down the HANS letting my head get closer to the steering wheel! Thats a big problem. Now i know the straps should be angled up on a harness bar and not straight or at a down angle. Right now its a down angle so im guessing thats why i can slide down???

With a HANS device, the maximum for belts is ~15-degrees up/down from horizontal at shoulder height.

You also want minimum distance back to where the belts are attached .... to minimise belt stretch in an "incident".

My harness bar has about 300-350mm of belt from my shoulders back to the bar (and my belts wrap around the bar - eye-bolts are best but warp-around is still serviceable.

You also want to adjust the shoulder belt so that the shoulder belt adjuster is near the top of the HANS at about collar bone level and the belts need to be cinched down "tight", really tight.

In an incident, the body will mo e forward and down into the seat and the HANS is designed to be gripped by the belt as your body slides under it a tad, which shortens the HANS retaining straps to prevent your head moving relative to your neck (which is the whole point of the device).

This PDF off the FIA website will do a better job than my description - it is from 2007 and you might find a more recent copy via Mr Google but it is what I used (and still use).

A fatality at Buttonwillow this past weekend has me thinking about safety again. My car is still fully OEM on the interior and I don't want to modify it until I'm ready to do everything at the same time. I want to keep the car street legal, so the question is, what's better: the OEM safety system, or something like this:

- Half-cage welded in
- Sparco Egro seats /w Removable Halos
- Center Net
- 6/7-point Harness
- HANS or Isaac Device

For the time being, I have a Simpson FIA Hybrid on order. It's compatible with the OEM 3-point belt and I'll post my impressions of it after my next event this Sunday.

When you said your shoulder belts are attached to the OEM bar do you mean the silver body stiffening brace ( that is often incorrectly thought as a strut brace)? If that's what you mean then that is certainly not safe. Looking at the attachment points for that bar and the mounting screws Plus sheet metal brackets it doesn't look that strong.

I suspect that you would be safer reinstalling your three points for the trip to the cage builder. You will need to unbolt the seat belt buckle from your factory seat and fabricate a bracket to attach it to your planted base

And with your issue with the HANS sliding on the belts. I have experienced that before at the track and it is a little unsettling. What I do now is try to sit as tall in my seat ( back as straight as i can) as possible as I tighten my shoulder belts. That seems to help.

Its a 5 minute drive. Im really not worried about that.

I tried again today. No luck. Im surprised that link to HANS says keep the belts at 20* below horizontal and not above. Maybe its HANS only that way as ive always read with a race belt it should be above horizontal.

The OEM bar is just thin sheet tubing. It's just for looks. Here is the install thread of my Robispec bar. There is some comments on harnesses in there too.

http://www.the370z.com/exterior-inte...r-install.html

Mine is definitely 15-20 degrees below horizontal. Really holds you upright when you cinch em down tight.

The FIA HANS writeup says:

2.4 The rear section of the shoulder strap should slope downwards from the uppermost point of
contact with the HANS®-belt-bearing-surface to the anchorage point on the car, preferably at about
20° below the horizontal, angles between 0° and 20° being acceptable as shown in Figure 4.

So it can be between horizontal and maximum of 20-degrees below horizontal ... understanding why they recommend less than horizontal is a question for the FIA and HANS engineers ....

I was with you .... horizontal belts were the way to go (in my mind because it is a "straight pull" and absence of spinal compression but since friction between belt and HANS device in integral to its operation, maybe that is the reason ... pure speculation on my part tho'

Heres my issue. Because im tall and can apply torque with the helmet i can pull the HANS and me forward and back. Without the helmet connected to the HANS i cant do this...

Its freaking tight!!! FYI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeAB9GSDlSo

im gonna have to go try this myself but i don't think i can move like you do, that definitely doesn't seem right

That is exactly what happens with my set up. It has always concerned me at the track. Maybe this type of movement is acceptable because the forces during a crash will be even across your entire body. Who knows though?

I would love to hear if anyone on this forum has experienced this issue and/or knows if this is acceptable.

Almost seems like the HANS or belt need an anti slip material.

I decided to jump to my garage and strapped in to my car with my helmet and HANS device. Try this, first make sure your lap belt and crotch strap is tightened. Then slip on your hans and helmet and tension up your shoulder belts.

Sit as tall as you can in the seat literally pushing your shoulders up against the belts. Then use your helmet and push hard back against your seat compressing the Hans device in the process. You will feel the HANS device being push up over your shoulders. Now while maintaining the pressure with your helmet and your shoulders tighten belts as hard as you can.

Any better?

2103 NISMO
Sparco Evo Seats
4 point roll cage
6 point Safecraft belts
Necksgen device

Cage, seats, belts done at Winding Road in Austin...great shop.

Juliann, my installer, said there is supposed to be a certain downward angle from the seat back slots to the belt attaching on the cross brace. I'm 6'2", so have to take the padding out of the seat bottom when I have my helmet on. But once strapped in with my Necksgen device I have very little forward or side head movement. Hope pics show. I did some research before deciding on a permanent roll cage set up. Can't say it was scientific, but seemed to be the safest alternative when using a Hans or Necksgen device. Also, the top bar is back far enough I don't worry about contacting it when I'm not wearing a helmet. Hope the pics that follow show the set up.

Cage and seat back

Another view

Still getting ready...but Necksgen and belts on

How is the Necksgen in terms of side-impact protection? I have a Hybrid, but I'm looking at the Sparco Ergo for Halo protection.

Ban25,

The literature on the Necksgen says it offers the same features as the HANS device to include side protection. I honestly don't know what is considered acceptable side protection. I do know it's quite comfortable to wear and easy to exit my car with it still attached to my helmet. The guys at Windong Road in Austin recommended it and said they are getting good feedback from other users. It does advertise side to side movement, but when I'm strapped in tight, I have limited side movement. I can view my left side mirror but not my riight side mirror.

Mike thanks so much for you help...

Good lord per this my setup sucks still.

That seems over the top to me. :P

"statistically you are more likely to die while towing your car to the track"

I think this is actually a good guide. I say that with four stars ****

Guess I need to go to autozone for my ricer, I mean fire extinguisher.

I think fire safety is important even in HPDE. Although I am NOT saying that a fire suit is a absolute necessity. You just want to make sure that you can survive a couple seconds of flash fire giving you a chance of getting out of the car.

I wear a traqgear podium long sleeve shirt, nomex balaclava, denim jeans, nomex gloves, nomex socks, and SFI rated shoes.

If you can't get/wear/afford a track suit. Wear natural fiber clothes. Cotton or wool. Do not wear synthetics like polyester or the other stuff. If you are wearing a poly clothing in a fire. You will be shrink wrapped in it. In the ER, they will have to peel the clothing and your skin off together. :eek:

Heck if you can't afford a fire suit you're probably not doing many DEs. My custom suit was under $600. That's less than two DE weekends usually.

At work. We have to wear natural fiber clothing. Some have to wear FR clothing.

True, but many people especially beginner HPDE with a mostly stock, newer, and lower power car really have a very low risk of fire injuries with simple every day cotton clothing. The HPDE I go to require long sleeve cotton shirt, socks, and denim or cotton pants. I do think an extinguisher would be beneficial in reducing damage to the car. 25 dollars can do a lot to prevent a total loss of a car.