A mini cooper could keep up with a GTR given the advantageous road course. Let's not forget that these articles are written by reviewers who tend to be a bit biased and or just opinionated. You could probably find an article praising how the Z demolishes the brz in every way if you look hard enough

If everyone just bought what they wanted and didn't give a crap about what other people thought (and didn't feel the need to justify their purchase every second of the day) they would be happy!

I'm not butthurt. I just said I'd believe it when I see it, and I kinda doubt it's as good as they're hyping. But you make a good point about comparing things up-scale. Too bad I can't agree with you out of principle, only because it's you. :icon17:

Fanboy

No surprise to anyone that the brz takes it on a tight course. We all expect it to run up with the Evo and s2k in autoX rather than with the z....why would we expect it to be different in a rag test?

:gtfo2:

He's also convieniently forgotten the S2000.

So has Honda

It would have been more fair to compare this to the late RX-8. That car started out as having great potential also, with handling dynamics likely similar to the BRZ. The BRZ/FRS will have the same gripes buyers of the RX-8 had including myself. Not enough torque and an engine you really have to flog to be fun. I know it's borderline magazine racing, but the performance number so far makes the BRZ/FRS a near clone to the RX-8. That car had rave reviews which often won over critics when compared to the 350Z also.

Mazda RX-8
Torque: 159 ft-lbs. @ 5500 rpm
Horsepower: 232 hp @ 8500 rpm
Curb weight: 2900-3100 lbs
C/D TEST RESULTS:
Zero to 60 mph: 6.3 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 16.5 sec
Standing 1/4-mile: 14.9 sec @ 95 mph
Top speed (drag limited): 150 mph

Subaru BRZ
Torque: 150 ft-lbs. @ 6400 rpm
Horsepower: 200hp @ 7000 rpm
Curb weight: +/-2800 lbs

PERFORMANCE (C/D EST):
Zero to 60 mph: 6.0–6.2 sec
Zero to 100 mph: 15.5–15.7 sec
Standing ¼-mile: 14.7–14.9 sec
Top speed: 143 mph

AUTOBLOG TEST RESULTS:
Zero to 60 mph: 7.3 sec
Zero to 100 mph:
Standing 1/4-mile: 15.3
Top speed:

:roflpuke2::roflpuke2:

I love me some s2000.

S2000, so :superghey:

Maybe I am giving everyone the benifit of the doubt, but no one seems upset or butthurt...:wtf2:

And if the automaker wants to compare their vehicle to another automaker, thats one thing, but when mags and/or people start making comparisons based on handling characteristics and ignoring everything else then what is the point of even making the comparison... It ends up being just a bunch words not evern worth the paper they are written on. Case in point, you mention the Z being able to hang with the GTR's on a certain track, so why don't we compare the BRZ to the GTR?

I guess my point is, yellow journalism is stupid...:shakes head:

Totally unrelated to the above, one of the first things the article says is this:

We’ve come to the Cote d’Azur to find out one thing. Has the Subaru BRZ earned its place at the top table alongside the likes of the Mazda RX-7, Nissan 200SX and Toyota Supra.

And then it never actually uses these cars as a comparison. Lol.

Z33>Toyota Supra :stirthepot:

Hey now...don't be hatin on the KA, it's a pretty stout little engine and has a lot of potential once you throw on some FI. :p

And I hear nothing but good things about the Mustang these days. I think the Camaro is starting to come along pretty nicely as well.

Leaf=Prius>BRZ>Z33>Supra :stirthepot:

What's a Z34? :confused:

Id say people are butthurt. Everyones saying its a dumb comparo, that no way the z would loose.. blah blah. No ones mentioned, hey, if its unfair to compare it to the z, why is it fair tocompare it to the miata.??

and the reason you SHOULDNT compare it to the 200sx, supra, rx-7 is that those cars are like 10+ years old... The idea he was trying to convey, is that is this car, good enough to be thought of like those cars, many years later.

but. anywho.

Every article, review has said the brz handles great. That its really awesome to drive. They didnt say its the fastest thing out there. With the concept in mind, and what they were trying to achieve with the car, i'd say perhaps they did it right. I havnt driven one to say from personal experience, but ALL the reviews seem to say so.

I didnt say the z to a gtr is a good comparison, making the brz to gtr a good comparison.. your just reaching there. The point was, that given the circumstances, cars that you didnt think could, can keep up with other cars. DOesnt mean its a better car, or faster etc. Give me a indoor go cart race, and truthfully, id chose to race a toyota iq instead of a z on it. (or a go kart duh)

Does that mean i shuld compare new go karts to the z? ... no...

And if the mags, didnt make comparions against CURRENT cars that are in the same market segment, (not same class) what would they do?

They took 3 cars that are supposed to be FUN, sports cars that reward the driver. I think they picked the 3 right cars to compare.

Ok, I see what you are getting at. Personally, I have no experience with the Miata, so I can't comment on how well I feel they match up. Maybe it shouldn't be compared to the Miata as much as it shouldn't be compared to the Z.

I agree that this is what the writer wants to answer. However, the writer never actually comes back and revisits this original premise. The article immediately shifts into comparing it with the Miata and the Z, calls them blunt/dull comunicators and then says it is possibly the best car to come from Japan since the NSX.

I guess all of that could be a convaluted way of answering the question of whether the BRZ is as good as the Mazda RX-7, Nissan 200SX and Toyota Supra, but if it is, that is just poor writing.

I never made the assertion you had claimed the Z to GTR was a good comparison nor made the assertion myself, simply that the comparison proves my point that making comparisons based upon handling characteristics is dumb because you can find vehicles all across the spectrum that can handle well be it a go kart or an Aventador.

I agree that Subaru and Toyota seem to have made a very good vehicle from everything I have read on it, although I am not keen on the price of the vehicle.


But are they in the same segment? I wouldn't think so, but at the same time I don't really know what would be more appropriate so maybe it is. Like bvl mentioned, I think we will end up seeing it compared to some FWD setups in the future. Perhaps that is a more appropriate segment, but maybe not.

The BRZ really is a very unique vehicle right now. Like I previously said, I hope it does well. I would really like to see more vehicles like it start poping up.

I hope this helps to clarify some.