Shifting 1st to 2nd
 

Can someone shed some light on a minor snafu I am having. I have driven MT's for many years...actually learned at age 14 in my grandfather's old Mercury.
For some reason, I am having occasional issues achieving smooth shifts between 1st and 2nd gears. Every other shift is silky smooth. 1st to 2nd is "lurchy"...
I notice that if I clutch in and out verrrrry slowly and throttle up slowly I can smooth it out a bunch, but it really wears me out. Is it me, or does anyone else experience a finicky 1st to 2nd shift? I love my new 370 Z. I really believe that this is just a normal issue with the 370Z maybe? I never grind any gears...I just fight the "lurch" from 1st to 2nd.

1 to 2 on the 350 and now the 370 seems to be an inherit "feature" of the transmission.
It will take sometime, but after awhile you will find that smooth transition that works for you, I know it took me months.

Beat me to it. Both transmissions act almost exactly.

Thanks for the feedback. At least I know now that it is a somewhat normal issue. I will get used to it. If anyone can speed the process for me with a suggestion, please let me have it. I will experiment with shifting at higher and lower RPM's, as well as clutch speed and throttle.

For me, slow = smooth between 1st and 2nd.

E

Someone one here mentioned once 'a little bit of gas at the engagement point' when shifting. that idea has helped me totally smooth out my shift from 1st-2nd. If you are shifting at a lower RPM, which you probably are right now since you most likely just got the car (3 posts) push in the clutch just a bit slower than you think you should, and you can let it out quick until RIGHT before the engagement point. Then a very little bit of gas as you smoothly come off the clutch. You know how to shift already, just imagine trying to do everything absolutely perfectly, and that what you have to do to get a perfect shift from 1 to 2. it will come naturally once you drive the car for a bit. Take every stop sign, stop light etc as an opportunity to practice your N-1-2. I stop at every stop sign in my Z just to see how smoothly i can get it

During normal driving, I've found that if I push the clutch pedal in a bit faster than I would normally, my total shift timing is more conducive to smoother shifts (note..I let the clutch out at my normal rate). Since the clutch pedal effort is so light, pushing the pedal quickly is easy. Shift smoothness is all about timing...throttle, clutch and shifter. I'd rather push the clutch in more quickly than be more aggressive with the shift lever...why put added stress on the syncros, I say.

Driving a manual Z is not difficult, but driving/shifting it super smoothly is somewhat challenging. First and foremost, the clutch pedal is too light and short on feel. Then there's the built-in throttle float which doesn't help. Lastly, the e-throttle could be a bit more aggressive...getting the desired engine response takes a bit too much pedal throw.

Another tip...when lifting off the throttle between shifts, don't take your foot off the throttle pedal. Try to keep it in contact with the pedal. This will improve throttle timing when you reapply throttle.

I've found unless I 'm pushing higher revs 5k+ the lurch is there unless I'm slow with clutch/gas an really low RPMs....try going from 1st to 3rd.... no lurch,no problem :tup:

the engage point is kinda funky on the clutch, once you get used to it, the smoothness should come.

your 1st gear engagement from standstill has a lot of influence of how much more or less control you need between the 1-2 shift.

engage 1st from about 1.8-2k rpm. that makes the car wind up smoother in 1st so it's easier to level off the throttle to prepare for 2nd gear. clutch-in, slightly apply gas to keep the flywheel in the positive momentum and engage clutch gently. there should be no slip into 2nd gear. good luck.

you engage your clutch for 1st gear at 1.8-2k? aren't you burning your clutch doing that? I engage around 1k 1.5 tops in normal driving. I specifically try and avoid reving above 1.5k from a stand still in normal driving. am i wrong?

No you're not wrong. 1.8 to 2k is high and will prematurely wear out the clutch.

That's the rpm when I have the clutch all the way in. Then the rpm drops as the car picksup momentum. So the full engagement point is lower but not by much.

Engaging into 1st is not a competition of how low you can go. Heck I can engage 1st with zero throttle input and still get the car to go, but depending on traffic and how quickly i want to accelerate, the rpm will vary. On my G I usually engage 1.5K range and its fine, but on the z, I engage much higher. Give it a shot.

And no, unless you're riding the clutch (dragging the engagement for a long duration like 5seconds) its not going to burn it out. A lot of newbs worry about this but it actually takes quite a bit to burn out a clutch.

cool thanks. i mean. i'm sure its better to neither over nor under rev upon engaging the clutch, but thats impossible. i've been under the impression that any amount i rev over 1.5k is just wearing out the clutch so i have been really anal about not doing that, but its nice to know that its not that big of a deal.

Nah man, don't worry about burning the clutch on normal driving based on the RPMs unless you're REALLY holding it at the friction point. Since your shifting through gears vs a initial launch where you feather the clutch it shouldn't be an issue. If you think about it. When shifting through the gears you're only on the friction point for such a short time since the clutch is being led out smoothly without much pause compared to holding the friction point during N-1.

I also engage higher out of 1st.

Also, It too took me nearly 2 months to get smooth shifts in my Z.

Thanks to all for the feedback. I actually got pretty smooth shifts today between 1 and 2 when I took the rpms to about 3500 in 1, hit the clutch a bit quicker, and maintained a slight bit of throttle with some subtle accelerator pedal pressure and a slower release of the clutch. The other gears are no problem...smooth and silky. By the way, I am trying to abide by the break-in period set forth in the Owners Manual by keeping the rpms down through all gears during this period. I will get used to it...1 to 2 is just a bit sensitive in this car.

Yeah, I've had the car for almost 2 months now and sometimes when I rush that 1st to 2nd shift, I still get a nice CLUNK! Just gotta' keep it slow and smooth to start and after a while muscle memory will work its magic.

I dont get that clunk when I shift from 1st to 2nd. Its all smooth as silk.

I've had my 370Z for just over a year and a 350Z almost two years directly prior - I've still not gotten a smooth 1-2 gear shift 100% :P I also don't leave the house much since I work from home a lot ;) So not too much practice. But all the advice here I've tried myself and various combinations will work for your own personal driving style.

And yea, that *clunk* is so annoying, but it's just another thing you learn to live with. Only happens now and again for me

i thought you drove an auto? why would there be any clunk?

:stirthepot:

you and that pot stirring!

and pot smoking

The gears are far apart or something. You have to let the rpm's drop more than you would normally for the other gears. If you shift to fast from first to second its not smooth.

Let go of the clutch slowly.

I find that too many people slam the clutch all the way to the floor when they need to only press it slightly to shift gears. The clutch makes a smoother transition when the RPM's are between 3 and 4K. I suggest getting a feel for your particular clutch when it engages. Driving a manual is an art form that always needs to be perfected.

The earlier posts in this thread conclude that for the reasons stated, throttle float etc., the rpms do not drop quickly enough after releasing the clutch in first gear. That would mean the clunk is caused by the rpms being too high for the smooth transition to second. This is supported by those who say going from first to third works smoothly. Later posts say increase the rpms before shifting, which would seem to make the problem worse.

Because the car has 6 speeds, the gearing is close together, so the cars momentum together with the rpms not dropping quickly enough contributes to second being too low a gear for the car in that situation - third works better. Under hard acceleration the car "needs" second and the problem goes away. The car has so much power it doesn't "need" 6 gears for slow, in traffic, driving.

I think if you tried to drive a formula one car in heavy traffic, the same thing would happen ( if they had manual transmissions).

Maybe the first to third in slow traffic is the answer??

good to hear. yah, usually take 1st gear to near 4K rpm on all my cars for "normal" acceleration. :tup: :p

the slight bit of throttle does help. :)

:icon14: i dont skip gears.

Yeah...I paid for all 6....I intend to use them!...:tup:

nuthin wrong with skipping gears. I might start giving first to third a try. Makes sense actually if you're just driving normal. I usually skip from 3rd to 5th since I power up to 50mph and then cruise

I tried shifting from 1st to 3rd on my way home from work yesterday, and coming to work this morning. It seemed to get rid of the clunky shift. FWIW, I had an 02 Altima, and it clunked the same way from 1st to 2nd. Maybe it's a "feature" inherent to Nissan cars? :)

I think its the VDC working that causes the jerkiness. It seems to be on overkill in the first 2 gears where giving any amount of moderate gas causes it to kick in. Turning it off makes 1-2 shifting smooth and effortless like it should be. I'm not saying you should go ahead and turn it off every time and go gun-ho though. We've seen enough of the pics of Zs that flew off the road with VDC off.

:bowrofl:

I've been having that similar problem with my 370z too. It's just recently I've got my car to not lurch as much from 1st to 2nd. I think the only way to overcome the jerk completely is to not accelerate hard on 1st gear & shift early. I've noticed that when shifting happen in higher gears you don't feel the transmission as much. The reason behind it is because there's less acceleration/deceleration. In an automatic car you won't get the feeling of deceleration when you press in the clutch in a manual car - I always watch my passenger's head tip forward whenever that happens, that's my gauge as to how I smooth I'm driving. My suggestion is to just shift early in 1st gear and go very slowly if you want to drive it smooth. I also notice in my Lexus Automatic transmission, it is programmed to shift very early at 1st gear. I think it's because 1st gear is Geared for higher torque output, which is why you really have to go easy on it. My other suggestions would be to not slam on the clutch pedal, and also try easing off the gas before you shift as well as you gas in - this will for sure slow down the process of acceleration.

So to your concern about wearing you out, I really don't think there's a way around that. I really think it's less of a issue for the driver than the passenger. When you're shifting, so are less susceptible to feel the jerk motion because you know when it's happening.

Now I think it's really hard to launch fast (or not accelerate slow) from a stop and not feel a lurch. You really gotta be either equipped with a super quick transmission, usually an AT in this case or a CVT. That's just my 2 cents.