370Z Supercharger or Twin Turbo
 

Guys,
I know I'll catch a lot flak for this thread, but I'm literally stuck in limbo on this decision. I'm trying to make an educated decision by factoring cost, car usage, purpose, and overall benefit of each to. I'm a very spirited driver, but I only drive my car in nice weather (no rain, 70+ degrees). I don't have very many miles on the car (2009 - 12,000). Most of my driving can be classified as street / touring. I have most of the car set-up for track, which I plan on starting to take it there. I guess what I'm asking for is help / guidance from those experienced enough to make a decision on a supercharger or turbo. I like many aspects of each kit. The supercharger is enticing because of its lower amount of upkeep, higher safety rating, less slope in the power curve, and would seem (my thought) to benefit me more for my particular type of driving. The turbo kit provides a much more aggressive power curve and better results in the end, but I've never had a turbo'ed car. With both kits now relatively around the same cost, this decision is becoming ever so hard to make..lol I should probably add that my goal is to be somewhere near 500 rwhp. 500 is my ceiling / hard cap with no exceptions. I understand that many other factors go into making a decision of this sort, and I can do all necessary things to ensure that the correct steps are done to ensure saftey with this mod. Any feedback on this post will be greatly appreciated. :tup:
Thanks a lot guys

Well like you mentioned in your post, superchargers have better street ability but tend to make less power and turbos make more power but lose some street ability.

It really all comes down to what you want to build and how you want the car to respond.
I will personally recommend a supercharger, it keeps a similar power band to a stock car because the supercharger matches boost with revs so the harder you push it, the more power it makes. Plus IMO the supercharger is the best mix between street ability and track day fun.

If you have a chance, I might recommend test driving both supercharged and turbo vehicles. You can probably do this for free at various dealerships. Obviously, the cars won't be the same as the Z, but you will get an idea of the driving differences in each system. For example, you've never driven a turbo, so there is a possibility turbo lag will turn you off immediately and completely (there are plenty of people like this - but I think they are generally just spoiled from the instant boost a supercharger provides). From your post, I would lean towards the supercharger :twocents:

Driving both is superior to any other sort of analytic approach to making your decision. I was very impressed by the SC (as you can see in my thread reviewing both).

SC's generally run cooler than turbo's. It would be easier to build some proper cooling for a SC'd car. I haven't gotten to drive my SC'd car yet so I can't say much about how it drives. Turbo's make serious power under the curve. It may prove a handful coming off a turn if you aren't careful. twins and twin scrolls come on pretty early in the powerband, they start spooling hard by 2k rpm and if running around 9-10 psi, they are at full boost before 3500 rpm. With a boost controller, you can tune it so it feels like a supercharger if you want it to be linear. At this point in time, jumping on the TT bandwagon would be the cheaper and bigger bang for buck alternative. Supplant the kit with a 34 row or two 25 rows for serious track duty and it should prove entertaining. A radiator would be recommended if you do go this route. The nice thing about superchargers is because it makes less torque, and the torque it does make peaks high in the rpm range, it is easier for the car and components to cope with the power increase. Clutches will last longer, less stress on the engine, so supporting mods won't hurt as much.

S/C is lower initial investment into your project, the single or twin set-up will be more costly initially but have substantial increase in headroom down the road.

We have been working hard with one customer to acheive 500whp on his Stillen supercharger kit. Looks like it might happen this afternoon on the dyno, but it has been a tough road to get there from the base kit. The TT kits we have done you just need to add a boost controller into the mix and re-tune.

Thanks,
Alex Goodwin
AlexG@motionlabtuning.com

OP: if you ever get the chance to drive a modified turbo car(OEM turbos are usually small except for the EVO and STI) take the chance, it will give you an idea as to how you car will feel with a turbo kit on it.

I would recommend the same for any car with a centrifigual supercharger(since thats the same kind of supercharger kits we have) and which ever you like, get that type of kit. Pretty much all kits are about the same and they make similar power.

2 words.... VRRRRMMMMMM PPSSSSSHHHHHHH!

this!!^^^

My vote is for TT, but I am biased. From the sound of your OP, I would say that SC would fit the bill. However, turbo(s) are addictive and got me hooked after owning an S13 - CA18DET. Good luck with your decision.

Sent from my SGH-T889 using Tapatalk 2

As there are no roots blower kits, on a budget, SC and a broader budget tt.

that said... what will you end up spending in part and labor...?

In two years, there'll be a new Z -- with unknown performance levels...

Patience sucks, but so does spending several grand without good reason. I think if you are really on the cusp, wait a bit and see what the Z35 offers.

An old bloke for whom I have enormous respect (famous in Australian motor sport "lore") once said Super-Charging is for cars and Turbo's are for trucks (actually, in retrospect, this probbaly implies diesel engines rather than gasoline engines).

I say this not to belittle the TT fraternity but just to point out that for track-day usage, where torque and throttle response is king (can I say KING), then S/C has to be the way to go.

With a well-specified S/C system, torque is linear whereas with Turbo, there are always concerns at lag, spool time and the need for anti-lag to keep the huffers a-puffin' ...

Google the name "Harry Firth" and you'll see lots of 60's and 70's references, but he has forgotten far, far more than most of us will learn in a lifetime - an Australian equilavent on a par with Caroll Shelby - again, not current, but the lessons are unbiquitous.

Remember the old adage, those that ignore the lessons of history are doomed to repeat the mistakes of history.

I am not entering into the kit vendor issue in any way shape or form with this post.

Well said and point taken.

I would just like to add that before I decided to go TT, I searched high and low for a Roots or TVS SC system. There are plenty of ways to piece one together, but I did not want to be the test bed either. Like someone else said, the Z35 is on the horizon........and you may want to sample it prior to making a 10k+ commitment.

If you're gonna spend the money to get power why not get more and get turbos. That was my take anyway. And aesthetically twin turbos on a Z make it badass:)

I beg to differ, TSC's look even more badass :stirthepot:

http://www.the370z.com/members/ss_fi...0-sc-power.jpg

That does look pretty beastly. There is only one issue. When someone happens to see under the hood with your setup, they will be like "OH Snap SUN!" as opposed to when they look under mine and only see some aluminum piping and some red cap looking thingies, lol.

http://www.the370z.com/members/roplu...35-stealth.jpg

I do have first hand experience on the kit actually lol. My friends 350z has it. I went with him when Stillen first installed the kit, the second time when he changed the pulley out,and the third time when he blew the motor and had to get it fully built. First of all Stillen wouldn't give him his carb sticker, and never will because he had test pipes which they never told him about. They claim you need to get tuned with stock cats, then switch them out if you actually want to make any kind of power, to get the carb sticker. Second of all their tune and customer service is complete **** lol. It's a joke. Don't get me started on the design of the kit either... Now he has a fully built motor and makes horrible numbers because the supercharger kit is such a pos. Even the tuner said the kit is complete garbage and will not make power even if he were to switch out the blower and run 20+psi. The guy that built the motor for my friend even said the kit is a complete pos. if one of the best Z tuners in the world, and a guy that builds motors for a living both equally agree on how bad stillens kit is, then it's pretty safe to say it's garbage. We all had a good laugh talking about it. Waste of money IMO. Stillen also doesn't warranty their kit, even though they tuned the car in house. Oh well, people don't have to listen to me. All I know is that I would never put that kit on my car in a million years.

iirc your friend having the kit doesnt mean you have the kit now does it?

if thats the definition of first hand then i must have first hand experience with the alpha 12 GTR, the stillen kits, turbo hondas, muscle cars and modding supras because my friends have those cars and i am always around them...

now im not doubting your friends experience, but out of everyone i have met and talked to either on the internet and in person at car meets, they have loved the kit and had no regrets about buying it, and in fact my uncle has the stage 4 stillen supercharger on his G35 and his car has been pushing strong since he installed it and if you want to stay away from stillen because of your friends experience then more power to you, but dont go around saying the kit sucks, the design sucks(seriously i dont get how the kit is designed poorly, its designed like any other OEM system which is draw through and not blow through like after market systems) when you don't even have it installed on your car

oh there is a whole lot more to modding then numbers, sure a 800whp big single turbo supra sounds amazing, but in all reality that car is not a good street car(because its all top end), there is a difference between a good track car and a good street car

A good track car needs better top end because you are never down low while on a track(besides starting), while a good street car needs lots of down low torque and the way i look at it is, you can have a dyno queen and talk numbers all day long, or you can have a car that makes less power up top but more power down low where most people need it

now im not saying the GTM kit sucks and the stillen kit rules or twin turbo 370zs suck, or single turbo 370zs suck as i dont have first hand experience with either kit but to say the stillen kit(or even the GTM kit for that matter) sucks when you never had the kit installed is not right, thats like saying verizon sucks, tmobile rules when you have been on sprint your whole life

Like you said, take it as a grain of salt. Even if I was in the same senario as my friend and said the exact same thing, you would still come off saying I don't have experience. I see the car just as much as my own Z lol, iv driven it more times then I can count. My opinion stands that the Stillen kit sucks. If you don't like my opinion, then simply don't comment back ;) your the one derailing the thread by throwing out different types of cars and other companies while your the one that said not to start it in the first place haha. This is why I don't like commenting on here because when I give my opinion, everyone gets all but thirst when what I'm saying pertains to them. No one has to listen or take what I say to heart. So what your saying is that I cannot comment on ANYTHING that i don't personally have? I really didnt read anything you wrote but I'm guessing you have the Stillen kit since your defending it so much? If not then you are not allowed to talk about it because your opinion doesn't matter. You also can't talk about other cars because you do not own them. Lol that's basically what your telling me. Durrr durrr durrr
Logan you know where to reach me ;)

You can run a wastegate setup with a boost controller and a small pulley on a supercharger. It makes it ramp up faster, and you will get a decent improvement in torque. Plus it gives you the option to run the boost up and down. I dont think anyone is running a setup like this on a supercharged Z yet.

I'm am so bringing the Red Devil to STL when I get the twins on her...:tup:. I think it's just a personal preference. The twin turbo/single the power is waiting for you to wake it up. With a supercharger it's always awake. So to speak. With the weather in Missouri, as an example it was 80 degrees one day and within 20 hours it was snowing:shakes head:, I think the twins would be a better option since it's only a dial turn away to lower the boost and power. Same in reverse. Just my :twocents:

Op,

Looks like you've gotten pretty good responses along with clutter that has been removed.

I can only also suggest to look over the FI for Noobs sticky threads for addition questions.



http://www.the370z.com/forced-induct...ion-noobs.html

or

http://www.the370z.com/forced-induct...ion-noobs.html