I can empathize with that sentiment. haha

The answer to your horsepower question is yes...they can make the same power...so do our supercharger kits. ;)

The key is "performance". On this platform, a supercharger kit, a single turbo kit, and a twin turbo kit will all perform differently, in a "Good", "Better", "Best" sort of way. Sure, they all make boost and more or less the same horsepower on a stock engine. The real difference is how they deliver the power, and in terms of area under the curve, it is tough to beat the twin turbo systems on this platform.

Not really :) :

Dynosty Nissan 350Z custom single turbo vs. Forged Performance Nissan GTR E85 - YouTube

Power under the curve, I would say this is solid and comparable to a twin kit (twin scroll kit on a stock block 04 350z, on 9psi).

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q...scrolldyno.jpg

As for what is good, better, best...it all depends on the driver, and what the car is being used for.


Not trying to ster things up...just saying.

:usa: White flag

I think I just started a small war

Sorry!!!

I don't think there's anything wrong with having two companies competing in the same market "fight" for customers. Just my :two cents:. Either way when I'm ready, I'm going with GTM since they are only about 15 minutes from me.

^^^awesome man^^^ congrats.

So, you're trying to tell me that you would basically rather save $500 to get something like the graph you posted than get something like this?


I think the graph speaks for itself.

I agree with you that one size does not fit all...and that is why we offer so many different stages and options. People that go with our stuff can run whatever exhaust they want on both manual and automatic cars. If they want max power and go with our 3" cat-back they can do that, or use whatever off the shelf cat-back they want with whatever test pipes or HFC's they want. Internal gates or external gates, open dump or recirculating...whatever floats your boat. Not to mention that our turbo kit doesn't have to be removed to do a clutch job.

Don't get me wrong Sasha, you have clean welds and I tip my hat to you for making a viable single turbo option as a part time venture and doing a way better job of it than STS did.

Id wait for Fast intention Twin turbo kit.

then decide from there...
AAM
GTM
Greedy
Boosted Performance
Fast Intention

Might as well wait for GTM "twin" supercharger..

Mike, you are comparing my stock block 04 DE dyno to a 370z dyno (because no DE has ever made 276whp on a base run) Not sure the boost on that run either. Thre is almost a 10 year time laps between these two engines.

I also think that install cost should be thrown in the mix as well, not to mention ease of maintenance. It is not just a $500 difference, and I am sure many would agree.

It would be silly to get in to an argument over the two systems, as they are very different, and each have pros and cons.

EDIT:

I think this would be a much better comparison, as the engines are the same and boost is the same:

91 Octane fuel, 9 PSI, with a temp. manual boost controller:
http://i313.photobucket.com/albums/l...P/dyno0004.jpg

Specs on the build aboove:

GTM Stage 2 Turn-Key Twin Turbo System
Cosworth Intake Manifold
Cosworth fuel rails
600cc injectors
GTM ECU Flash
Upgraded MAF Sensor
GTM 14" Fan kit w/ fan controller
GReddy EVO TT Exhaust
S.S. Braided vacuum lines
GTM 3" Down pipes
Defi Gauges

Credit the Cossworth IM for carrying the power better in the upper RPM's.


SOURCE: http://my350z.com/forum/shop-builds/...p-413rwtq.html

WOW i never thought that i would see such a battle and the best part is that i dont have to watch it on PPV..lol

But all joking aside.... im a poor man that loves boot and fell in love with it ever sense i super charged my 06 hyundai tiburon back in the day:ugh2:. lol.. to this date in time i have no mods on the car because i dream of having that boost feeling again.

On that note I could never see myself spending more that $5500 or even $6000 for boost as much as i would love too.

What can i possibly do or get with a budget like that???:confused:

Subbed

Best bet, focus on some smaller mods, but line them up possibly for a turbo setup in the future maybe.
Good exhaust with maybe RTP, skip a full intake and do drop ins/MAF, some brake upgrades, oil cooler and while doing all that save a bit more and maybe in the future you can do a turbo setup.

Of course it's silly to compare a 350Z DE to a 370Z...I was quoting your post with the DE engine. Why you would have brought up a DE motor on a VHR forum is beyond me.

Ultimately, you are right...there is no comparison between a single turbo kit and a twin turbo kit. TT wins all day long. :)

PM sent. ;)

thanks just responded

Thank you for proving my point even more with your edit and our own graph from another forum. The TT kit is at 375ft-lbs of torque at 3500rpm...the same amount of torque as the single turbo was producing on the graph you supplied. Then the TT just continues to walk away from the single all the way to redline whereas the single falls on its face at 6k rpm. That sir, is area under the curve. Thank you.

Ya, boost spikes tend to do that..:bowrofl: It falls right back to 375ft/tq at 4200rpm. I can read a dyno graph.

Look at the first (6psi) dyno in that build thread.

Anyway, there is no point to this. The customers can decide which kit better suites them, and the budget they have to work with. Both are quality kits, and capable of making more power than 98% of the guys driving these cars will ever use.

Thank you guys for the insite you both are providing.. I hope this will also help new comers decide whats the best option for him or her.

im not going to lie but a girl with a boosted car = SEX... can i get an AMEN lmao

Just curious what is the install cost of the GTM TT kit vs Boosted Performance kit?

Can both kits be uninstalled and car returned to stock just in case it needs to go back to dealer for warranty work?

What is the average professional install time of both kits?


Thanks in advance.

SORRY A.D.D. KICKED IN:tup:

I can only speak for my kit..

All of my 350z customers have installed the kit themselves (this kit is no different). The kit can easly be removed, and the car can be returned back to stock, leaving no evidence (holes, cutting..ect) of there ever being a turbo kit installed.

A person (car owner in this case) who has worked on cars, can do the install of this kit in a weekend without much trouble. A shop should be able to do it in one day or less.

Thanks Sasha.

Not sure need pics...

Install cost varies greatly depending on whether you do the work yourself or have a shop do it (and however much their labor rate is).

That said, we charge 25 hours to install our kit here in house. Like I mentioned earlier, our turbo kit can stay intact for maintenance operations (such as changing a clutch) and therefore has no impact on the time it takes to do maintenance.

When we designed our turbo kit, we took the approach of "converting" the car to a twin turbo design and as such it is a comprehensive system that integrates with the car. While it certainly can be uninstalled and the car put back to stock, it is fairly involved.

Thanks Mike.

Subbed

...and then sweeps back up over 400ft-lbs by 5k. Gee whiz...I can read too. :bowrofl:

Anyway, you're right...it is pointless arguing about it. Comparing DE graphs on a 370Z forum is silly. Amusing, but silly. haha

So, when are we going to see some dyno graphs of your setup?

We have a tuner flying up here to tune about 10 z's. This car will be one of them. Unfortuantely this is not going to happen for another month or so.

Not many options up here when it comes to tuning with the UpRev.

Wtb good local uprev tuner :shakes head:

??????^^^^ is that better^^^^^?????

why yes it is.

I just dropped my laptop.

That's what you get for holding it with one hand.

:icon18:lmfao:roflpuke2:

OK, you got it going on. you backed it up.

But this Aint no Subi Forum.. How am I suppose to use this as a wallpaper?

so, Try again..;)

:o

I dont see much wrong with a turbo spooling full boost around 4k on a stock bottom end as its much easier on the connecting rods than one which making mounds of torque at a really low RPM (pre-3k). That is obviously more fun, but less advisable for a stock blocker for longevity.

The STS may not be able to make 600+, but its not quite as rough on your con rods with the high RPM spool either. :tup:

This is why you use timing to "ease" into it if you wish. A ST (close to the engine) will spool up by 3500rpm, you can see that in post #42, as peak tq is reached by 3500rpm. At the same time you can use timing and cam phasing to keep the torque lower/flat, to prevent rod damage. There is a lot more to tuning than just a/f.

Add to that RPM, Speed, and/or gear-based boost target tuning if you have an appropriate boost controller.

Sounds cooler when it takes a while to spool though... lol