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-   -   Successfull Tracking with Forced Induction?? (http://www.the370z.com/forced-induction/26946-successfull-tracking-forced-induction.html)

Mike@GTM 12-14-2011 08:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited (Post 1449926)
What? The dual 14" SPAL fan or something else. Dang it man! I'm on the edge of my seat over here. :driving:

And where does the A/C condenser get mounted? Or is it internal to the 70mm piece?

Doc Brown is trying to come up a name for it...I told him that Flux Capacitor is played out. So as soon as he comes up with a good name, I'll let you know. :P

The A/C condenser gets mounted up front.

Nixlimited 12-14-2011 10:30 PM

D'oh! Any pics of AC compressor installed with your radiator?

Shamu 12-14-2011 11:44 PM

Lots of posts but no real evidence anyone has successfully tracked FI car in warm weather ...You know someone who really pushes car on track at temps seen during summer. Without a lower compression build, huge amounts of cooling I don't see forced induction working for serious track car. I'm pretty sure I could manage engine heat by short shifting, etc. However I hate doing that. I want a car I can depend on. I also do Hillclimbs and I worry about FI as hill climbs I do are in 90 to 100 degree weather.

axio 12-18-2011 06:37 PM

So I hit Laguna Seca yesterday. Yeah, the temps were nice, just mid 60's, nothing hot. The sessions were 20-25 minutes long, and the highest temps I saw were 240 for one session. Most sessions I was hitting 220. I know mid 60's isnt a good indicator of summer temps, but not bad for forced induction on 20-25 minute sessions? I was mashing it on any occassion I could.

CSF Inc. 12-19-2011 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike@GTM (Post 1449884)

Our radiator is 70mm thick compared to the 30mm thick alternative and 18mm thick stock radiator.


Our radiator core is 32 mm thick. There is a big difference between the overall thickness of the radiator tank and the actual thickness of the core. A 70mm tank thickness most likely has a core of about 48-52mm (max).

With CSF you also get the advantage of our "B-tube" technology, which is the most efficient tube available in the aftermarket. This tube will increase the efficiency by almost 20%. Because of these special tubes, our complete unit is extremely light, which I know is very important to the track guys.
Also the requirement of buying additional and required products such as fan shrouds, fans, relays, harnesses is not needed with our drop-in fit unit.

Z eliminator 12-19-2011 05:04 PM

Great thread but we need to get a lower temp thermost that works.
does any body have one on there car that works ?

Nixlimited 12-20-2011 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSF Inc. (Post 1455845)
With CSF you also get the advantage of our "B-tube" technology, which is the most efficient tube available in the aftermarket. This tube will increase the efficiency by almost 20%. Because of these special tubes, our complete unit is extremely light, which I know is very important to the track guys.
Also the requirement of buying additional and required products such as fan shrouds, fans, relays, harnesses is not needed with our drop-in fit unit.

Can you clarify whether any of your offerings have a built-in oil-cooler? I think you mentioned that you considered it, but not sure if you ever did it.

CSF Inc. 12-21-2011 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nixlimited (Post 1457524)
Can you clarify whether any of your offerings have a built-in oil-cooler? I think you mentioned that you considered it, but not sure if you ever did it.

We have a unit which we make in very limited quantities for vehicles with an automatic transmission (CSF# 7011). For manual vehicles they can still use this oil cooler for additional cooling. The cooler is a 6 plate water-to-oil type cooler.

kosstick 12-21-2011 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CSF Inc. (Post 1458472)
We have a unit which we make in very limited quantities for vehicles with an automatic transmission (CSF# 7011). For manual vehicles they can still use this oil cooler for additional cooling. The cooler is a 6 plate water-to-oil type cooler.

is the cooler any better than the stock oil cooler.

_ace_ 12-21-2011 07:54 PM

The boost pressure is also a big deal. Tracking while boosting +5-7 psi is different from +16 psi. And superchargers seem to add less heat than a turbo or TT system at the same peak boost/hp level.

One way to make this work is to just get two tunes on a TT system: a very low boost tune (like 3-5psi, almost off) for extended track use and a higher boost tune for street/drag/auto-x/a single fast lap where heat buildup isn't as much of an issue.

modme 12-21-2011 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _ace_ (Post 1459046)
The boost pressure is also a big deal. Tracking while boosting +5-7 psi is different from +16 psi. And superchargers seem to add less heat than a turbo or TT system at the same peak boost/hp level.

One way to make this work is to just get two tunes on a TT system: a very low boost tune (like 3-5psi, almost off) for extended track use and a higher boost tune for street/drag/auto-x/a single fast lap where heat buildup isn't as much of an issue.

Gonna correct you on a couple of things. No one is tracking at 16psi. In fact, no one has reached 16 psi on a stock motor. For turbos, you can turn down your boost controller, but you can never go below the wastegate spring pressure, which is 5-6 psi.

For superchargers, you're stuck. Whatever pulley you have in there will determine the boost pressure. You cannot change boost levels easily.

And I'm pretty sure given the same horsepower and boost level, a supercharged car will generate more heat. In a supercharged car, a significant portion of horsepower (and hence heat) is wasted on spinning the supercharger. Whereas a turbo uses mostly exhaust waste to spin. This is the same reason the superchargers use a 650cc injector to make similar or less horsepower than a turboed car, which is using a 600cc injector.

Nixlimited 12-21-2011 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by modme (Post 1459061)
Gonna correct you on a couple of things. ...
And I'm pretty sure given the same horsepower and boost level, a supercharged car will generate more heat.

It's not really that simple. The thing to remember is that a TT car may make full boost at 3500 RPM, while a SC car won't make it until redline. Accordingly, the TT car is making much more power over the rev band--even if they ultimately have the same peak HP--which is clear when you look at a dyno plot of the tq of a TT car. All of this extra power will likely produce more heat than spinning the SC.

modme 12-21-2011 08:47 PM

http://i313.photobucket.com/albums/l...yno2000005.jpg

Looking at the supercharger dyno, the peak torque comes on pretty early too @4k. But you do have a point.

Nixlimited 12-22-2011 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by modme (Post 1459093)

Looking at the supercharger dyno, the peak torque comes on pretty early too @4k. But you do have a point.

I think that chart is a bit misleading because the SC run was clearly not recorded from as low an RPM as the baseline, and additionally, the TT just makes way more torque across the band. But yeah, I think we are on the same page.

pyrrhus17 01-15-2012 08:11 PM

So doesn't anybody wil FI track/autocross ? what the Hell is the point ofthis car on ramps and off ramps ? Come on you must be kidding at least you can track a mustang!!! WTF


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