PCV Delete, Catch Cans, and Unmetered Air
 

What setup are you guys running?

There are a few ways to do it, and pros and cons to most of them. I don't want unmetered air going in, but don't want the engine bay to look like the tar pits so something's got to be done. Had been planning on a catch can basic set up but there are better ways like a Moroso remote breather or Mighty Mouse set up.

So curious to learn about others setups and see what works best on the VQ

Sub'd

Moroso 85470

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/mor-85470
https://static.summitracing.com/glob.../mor-85470.jpg

Mighty Mouse Catch Can

mmsolutions
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Cusco Catch Can universal kit

http://www.the370z.com/members/chase...5402-cusco.jpg

Then there's always this :icon14:

http://www.the370z.com/members/chase...thers-3201.jpg

I run the valvecover check valves to the intake manifold. I run the valvecover open vents to the intake tubes (suction only side). I cant even count how many cars I did this way and never had a problem! If its a big boost car, I have over-sized the lines and enlarged the valvecover ports before.

Huh? Sorry trying to understand.. I really don't know much about catch cans.

Hmm I am not sure what other details I could include my description. But no knowledge of catch cans is required since what I am describing lacks the use of them at all. :)

lol I hear ya, I'll be doing some researching on them. Thanks

VP Scavenger Kit

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/vpe-11189/overview/
https://static.summitracing.com/glob.../VPE-11189.jpg

I include this one largely for conversation sake. I'm not considering it but it is an interesting idea, if it actually works. Then again if it did work would there not be the potential to coat your cats in an oily mess? Clearly you could put it further downstream but the further away the less change it would actually scavenge anything and produce any vacuum whatsoever.

This is me thinking aloud anyways.

I'm not running any of this stuff. Is that bad?

I use the Admin Tuning dual catch can/coolant reservoir. It's fully vented from the four ports into the atmosphere.


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A factory style PCV system allows oil vapor into the intake tract. An oil film will build up inside the intake tubing and intake manifold. This means you will consume a minuscule amount of oil through combustion, which according to the theory, will reduce the fuel octane.

That said, unless your engine is in terrible shape, the consumption is likely much too low to cause any perceivable increase in knock tendency. A looser fully built engine with tons of boost can have increased piston ring blow-by, increasing the flow through the PCV system. This is when I might start to consider a catch can, but I still would probably personally prefer to just go open on the ventilation to keep the engine bay less cluttered.

People with catch cans will observe what appears to be a significant amount of oil collected in their cans. I say if you put that oil back into vapor form and disperse it evenly through all the air the engine has ingested in that time, you would find it be nothing. There is also a question of how much of that oil collected is a direct result of eliminating the crankcase vacuum which many believe helps the rings seal, reducing crankcase vapors. If that's the case, it can make the catchcan a sort of self ful*filling* prophesy (see my pun there).

None of my belief is backed by scientific study. Just a matter of having always left it alone yet always having great success with my builds.

Great looking bay. Only thing i would change is one of the first mods I did to my 370z... rerouting the starter cable through the cowl instead of how the factory draped it over the timing chain covers.

After the research I have done I've decided to go with the following set up. I have two small mishimoto sealed catch cans. I capped off the intake. Breather filters on the pcv valves. Catch cans between the valve cover and the intake pipes. I am boosted so my line of thinking was if I put it as stated then I would still have suction under boost. If I had put the catch cans on the intake manifold pcv tubes then I would have no suction under boost. I'm just hoping that the catch cans are efficient enough to prevent oil on getting into the intake. I haven't been able to install my set up because my car has been at Z1 waiting for a tune for a long time. Their dyno is broke.


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Any news on when Z1's Dyno will be back up and running?

Looks amazing!!! Question, do the filters get in the way of the hood?

It's back up now!


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Nope. Hood closes perfect.


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Cool, I couldn't tell from the pics

AGREED. that's one DIY wire tuck I won't mind tackling.



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I hope I can mount my catch cans that way so I can keep my windshield washer reservoir!


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Interesting idea, I'll have to look at this.

Just to make sure it really is as simple as this.

The smaller lines on front of the valve cover are tee'd into the back of the Stillen intake as illustrated.

The 5/8 lines are looped together then tee'd at the drivers side where it continues to a vented catch can.

Would that not still leave unmetered air to be drawn in from the PVC elbow?? My elbow cracked this morning and that caused a complete vacuum leak as read on my boost gauge.

I don't want vacuum leaks obviously, not do I want unmetered air going in.

http://www.the370z.com/members/chase...1-img-3122.jpg

So improving on that diagram I deleted the 3/8 front line altogether. Each fitting on the valve cover has a 3/8 edelbrock uni-filter in it now instead and capped the fitting in the back of the manifold. The catch can breather part is staying the same.

Ok, so heres a break down from what ive learned the hard way..

you have 4 holes that need to breathe..

Your PCVs -
they are on the front side of the valve covers.
They dump 90% of the crap coming out of the crank case.
the hose inner diameter is 3/8" (metric equiv)

for forced induction, its highly recommended that to go to a catch can system with proper filtering here. its also recommended to drill out the pcv or get a pcv valve flow through from cjm. might want to plumb the exit from the catch can back to the intake pipes for proper vacuum..

if you do run the cjm flow through, that's 8an, so might want to run 1/2" elbow and hose to the catch can to reduce the amount of fittings and widen up the hose for more flow

I read on the gtr forums, that vacuum is an issue and that vent to atmosphere is counter-productive - in other words, anything that helps outflow the crankcase pressure under high boost is most likely best the best option.

your CCVs -
those are the holes to the back of the valve covers
drivers side is elbowed and the passenger side is straight
they hardly dump anything nasty if at all.
the hose inner diameter is 5/8

I dont see why these cannot be vented to air since they are fairly clean in comparison. running a line elbowed at the fender liner gap and down, secured and filtered should solve it.

IMO, i wouldnt add filters right at the pcv or ccv outlets.. these out outlets are pumping out noxious gases and they WILL get sucked up by your a/c - heater cabin inlet. Believe me i know... turning on the heater was short lived, i thought i was going to die of asphyxia. Not noticeable at highway speeds, but definitely at slower speeds. AND - the pcv will puke out sht and dirty up the engine

:pics::pics:


Disclaimer: do this at your own risk, drive the speed limit and drink plenty of water.

Do you have pictures of this? Sounds like a great setup. I’m trying to do the same type of thing right now but I have the Motordyne upper manifold and the vacuum connections are not on the front like the stock manifold.

Update from my last post...

The PCV and CCV definitely breathe together.. Originally i posted that adding the PCV to the catch can would be the answer, with vented CCV...

not the case... so the exit pressure from the engine want to find a way out... if there is restriction ( catch can filter element etc) in the PCV, the engine will puke out of the CCV... i found this out after doing some workj to the car and found what looked like residue under the car resembling an oil leak... after searching for leaks, i tracked to the wheel wells where my CCV hoses were.

So naturally, I would suggest a 3 port catch can per bank (2) OR a tee-off at the PCV flow through point per side, where you can bond the 5/8 line with the 3/8 line and send all outbound to the catch cans... the 5/8 line is odd since the exit from the CCV exit ( look inside the plumbing) is much smaller, so i dont anticipate a pressure bottleneck.
:tiphat:

Here's a setup I came up with. This would be the second time I'd done this.

I have been running this in my car for almost two years now.

I've switched the vacuum source of my PCVs to the Evap system. I've T'd the nipple behind the Throttle flanges to receive the air from the PCV.

In my vehicle and in my engine stand I've bought some generic 90deg tubes $2 ea at autozone and put a 3/8s hose and sent it towards the back.

In that curve that it goes up there seems to be plenty of room for a catch can on both sides.

The ones in these pictures are clear because I want to monitor the amount of oil they see. In my experience the braided pool hose will darken and deteriorate faster in an engine with higher PCV contamination.

I will be testing differences in AFRs between my setup and the OEM setup since in my set up I see a bit more crank case vacuum than OEM I also see improperly distributed PCV gasses due to the new vacuum location. I'll compare between both however if there are differences then it would be really interesting to see how much could they affect AFRs and driveability.

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