Transmission removal and CSC
 

Need a little help from someone whom has "been there, done that."

Pulled the transmission and getting ready to put everything back together. I'm a bit confused regarding the Concentric Slave Cylinder. If you read the manual it says to never reuse the CSC. Does that mean every time you remove the transmission or every time you remove the CSC? The factory manual (for me anyway) is not clear. My assumption is being the actual CSC is not removed, you do not need to replace it. IF it were removed, (not just the transmission) you would replace it.

Can someone tell me if I'm right or wrong.

Denny

CSC isn't that expensive compared to the labor of having to replace one down the road after doing clutch work. Also, you wouldn't want dust particles to get sucked into CSC lines which will cause it to fail sooner.

In this case, you're better off with a new OEM CSC or heavy duty one. I vote for heavy duty. The OEM one will fail sooner or later.

I understand they are not a lot of money. Guess my question is it it necessary to replace one everytime the transmission is pulled?

Denny

How often are you planning on pulling the transmission?

Should you even replace the heavy duty ones when you take it apart? Or can you reuse those?

What does that matter? The question is do they need to be replaced everytime a transmission is pulled? No other question. Period!

Denny

The service manual says yes. And Lemon-Fresh was just getting at if you dont swap it out now the trans will be coming out sooner or later again. Hence the question.

Also, being the CSC was never removed. Just the trans. The manual is not clear, it just says to replace it every time the CSC is removed..


REMOVAL AND INSTALLATION
CSC (CONCENTRIC SLAVE CYLINDER)
CAUTION:
• Never reuse CSC (Concentric Slave Cylinder) body and CSC tube. Because CSC slides back to the original position every time when removing transmission assembly.

Denny

I think its pretty clear? Maybe I am misreading it?

"Because CSC slides back to the original position every time when removing transmission assembly"

Yes, It must be replaced, At least with the stock unit. When the trans is installed the slave is compressed, when you remove the trans the slave extends all the way out collecting all the debris (abrasive clutch particles) into the seal of the slave.

We have had a few people reuse our HD version after pulling the trans without any issues although we recommend changing it if it has been in for a longer amount of time, We offer a new cylinder by itself (no lines, adapters ect) at a lower cost, or you can send the whole thing back and we can replace/rebuild it for you.

I just had one of our long time, one of the first users, of our HD slave kit contact us about our Wilwood master cylinder upgrade as his stock one is wearing out and this is what he had to say about the HD slave kit.

Quote..
" Not sure if you remembered me, was 1 of the 1st few to use your metal csc, i'm located in Singapore its a fantastic product, lasted me 2 rebuilts of my os giken twin plates total around 50k miles with heavy usuage in drifting"

Pretty sure he is still using it now.

Good to know!

That's the kind of answer I was lookin for. Thank you.

Denny

I just finished my clutch the other day, used Joe's CSC, night and day when you see them side by side. Being these things are failure prone, I would replace it. These trannys are easy to take out, but its still a pain and at lease a good half day to a day down time, let alone if you need a tow.

Ooh I see what you mean. I had 2 HD CSCs. The first one was good, but I went ahead and replaced it because it endured lots of stress from disc failure (tons of soot build up in the bell housing). The second CSC went through a couple of transmission swaps in a month, and it is doing well. I'm definitely looking forward to the new master.

Called a local dealer checking on availability of a CSC and in the DFW area (13,000,000 people) there was only one in stock in the whole area. This raised a red flag as this is a huge Metro area. Either the customer must wait 2-3 business days to receive the part, or they are not replaced each time. Let's just say, I'm suspicious they are.

After removal of the CSC (bought a replacement) it appears that yes, there is clutch disc contamination as mentioned by Joe at ZSpeed. However, after playing with it, they can be flushed out quite easily. The existing CSC is fairly new as it was replaced under warranty by the dealer. Knowing what I know now, I'd never purchase a new one. Just flushed out the old one and remove the source for potential failure. The contamination can be easily removed, and I'm keeping the part for future use.

Live n learn.

http://imageshack.us/a/img5/145/p2070299.jpg

Denny

Even after you clean it, the O-ring of the OEM CSC will still deteriorate. I sent Joe the failed OEM CSC for additional analysis. Maybe you can try to rebuild it with new seals.

The first HD-CSC was fine, but there was a thick layer of soot due to clutch disc burning up from rubbing against the flywheel. It was gross, so it necessitated replacement. I went ahead and ordered a new master (first one already failed in Houston after getting the new turbos and clutch kit installed) and HD-CSC. The new transmission had 5th gear issues after a month so they ordered a new one. I figured the new one didn't have much miles so it didn't need replacement.

So did you pull your transmission at your house??

I seriously doubt that if flushed well. Rubber is not going to deteriorate for the sake of deteriorating if properly cleaned. There was a pretty high rate of failure on factory CSC's and I'm sure if you tore a failed one apart, the O ring might very well be the culprit but that is not a apples to apples comparison.


Denny

Yep, and the engine also.

Denny

I've torn lots of them apart, Over 50 actually and these are just the ones I received in one piece. A lot of them just break when the release bearing itself breaks off its plastic mount, That's if the seals lasted long enough for this to happen.


If you flushed it out with any kind of solvent you most likely got in on/in the release bearing also which will wash out the grease in it causing the bearing to lock up which spins the entire housing breaking/melting it off the front of the CSC.
Save yourself the trouble and NEVER reuse it, Unless of course you like tow trucks and pulling your trans for fun..

http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphoto...79930144_n.jpg

Some good info Joe - Thanks:tiphat: