paint care expectation: swirls and polish skills inevitable?
 

This will be a really quick thread, but is this a true general statement?

If you don't seal/wax from the start, you *are* going to get swirls on your paint no matter how carefully you wash, dry, and drive?

This is just one of those things where if I know this is true, it affects my approach to paint care as well as my expectations. I have noticed the beginning of some micro-scratches that will eventually result in your typical swirl patterns in a few years. It also means that unless someone knows all the steps at the start of owning a car with brand new paint, then that person really should be open to learning how to do some entry-level polishing with a DA orbital. (right?)

This is part of my learning process. :) (It's not that I am scared of polishing, it's just not very convenient for me in an apartment!)


(In my role of network/systems security and administration, the statement, "You *will* suffer a security breach someday," affects my approach to the job.)

um sealant and wax do not prevent swirls from happening!

No matter how careful you are, swirls and micro scratches will end up on the paint. EVENTUALLY

proper washing will cut down on the damage but its almost impossible.

Agree completely. Fortunately, the necessary paint correction techniques are well outlined, straightforward, and generally affordable. The results of polishing, even for a novice, are fantastic and highly rewarding.

Deff agree! Some people see paint damage and think omg I need to repaint this piece! nope, simple paint correction and your golden...

However, if the paint is faded under the clear coat you cant fix this with paint correction!

If I were you, I wouldn't get my network security advice from whoever told you that. You'd be hacked before the computer finished booting.

Look up opti-coat, that's what you'll need to minimize swirls. But you gotta have a perfect paint to start with.

Most of my swirls came as a dealer installed option.

What these guys said. Check out Junkman2008's videos - excellent info.

Yep. Everything I know I learned from his videos. The downside is that his videos lead you down a slippery slope. First you buy a polisher, and then you just start sending your paychecks dierectly to Detailer's Domain and Adams.

Not true at all. You need to know how to correctly TOUCH your paint when it is dirty in order to minimize paint damage. The way you are thinking is like saying that you need a very big gun in order to kill someone. What you need is simply a gun and the training and ability to SHOOT STRAIGHT. It doesn't have to be big at all. ;)

What you're saying has nothing to do with what I said. Let's not make this a pissing contest you've been waiting for all week.
Opti-coat and products like it add extra layer(s) of protection. Regular maintenance or care is another topic.

Everything that touches your clear coat has the ability to scratch it. The softest towels can be "pushed" to scratch. I used to give towels the "cd" test and I never found one that couldn't scratch. Hell, I've even seen the ridges of my fingerprints scratch clear coat. I try to minimize contact all time and do a light- medium polish every few years. That has worked for me for many years.

I did Opti-coat my car when I bought it back in 2012. It really is a neat product.

Wow, who pissed in your Cheerios this morning? No one is looking for a pissing contest, I'm just giving out solid advice. I don't have, nor have I ever had any kind of coating applied to my paint and I keep it swirl free because I KNOW how to touch my paint. It's that simple and I have the videos and pictures to back that up. If you would like to post the same to prove your point, I would be MORE than happy to see it.

Junkman, why do people think wax and sealant are going to prevent swirls.... smh...

Opticoat isn't a wax or sealant. It is a coating that is harder than your factory clear coat so it "resists" swirls. Nothing short of not touching your paint will prevent swirls.

no. but you can swirl it when you go to wash it (or your dealer...) using wrong tools and techniques.

sealant and wax's primary function is it makes contaminants harder to bond to the paint and provides some level of uv protection (so they say). and makes the car look prettier...if done right.

I tried to be judicious in my wording of the topic, but I guess I fail. :)

Thank you for the replies. My mind is in the right place, but the words were not. I got the answers I needed/expected, though, namely: Learn polishing. It's inevitable.

This is true. However, so many people are under the illusion that applying these coatings will allow them to go Tasmanian Devil on their paint without any repercussions. Like you have stated, nothing short of never touching your paint will keep it from ever being scratched but PROPER touching of your paint will keep it damn near flawless. My last video where I did the restricted wash is a good example of this. I had more dust sitting on that car than Joan River's date book and didn't leave one scratch in the paint after removing all that dust.

Yes, polishing is inevitable but there is no reason that the only polishing you should ever have to do is very LIGHT polishing. If you don't create major damage and stay on top of what little may show up, your polishing routines should be infrequent and quick. Just like someone who exercises frequently, you are only addressing small weight fluctuations instead of trying to drop 200 pounds way after the fact. Proper preventive maintenance is the key to perfect paint.

Thanks man, that's basically the answer I was expecting to get, but I kinda needed to hear it from the folks here who have more experience than me. :)

Being new to all of this, my first reaction was that if I was very careful and on top of everything and waxed regularly, I could prevent swirl marks. A very false assumption, but one I made nonetheless. By dashing away that assumption and making what is otherwise a new statement, it adjusts my approach and thus how I measure happiness/success. :) In other words: preventing swirls is not success. Dealing with them when they do inevitably appear and leaving behind perfect paint is success.

I do everything I can to prevent swirls, that's success for me. Polishing is punishment for not being successful at keeping swirls off my car. :)

yah, most newbs induce swirls while waxing and buffing too...

Honestly if I ever have dust sitting on the Z I use my 60 Gallon husky air compressor and go to work :p

California Duster here. I'm not as careful as Junkman. I accumulate a few swirls and some micrmarring, as well as occasional staining from splattered bugs. Buffing is no big deal.

One thing to keep in mind is that YOU, the owner are not the only element that you are battling from paint damage. There's that fat guy brushing up against your car as he walks by or that chick with the purse as big as Texas. That's why you have to decide before you pull out of the driveway if you are going some place where parking is tight and hard to find. If that's the case, take the hooptie. That's what I do.

Heck yeah! I park in the boonies any time I go someplace. If I can't, or I'm going to be away for more than an hour (movie, show, game) I leave the Z at home.

I'd rather walk an extra 50-100 yards than come back to a door ding or worse. Besides, it's good for me!

More than one streak of white paint has appeared on my gray '98 Ranger from people being careless with their doors at the office. Because some coworkers wanted to see it, I've driven the Z to work one time & had to do some strategic placing of work vehicles the day before to make sure I wouldn't pick up any dings.
Whenever possible, the Z gets parked in the back 40.

What a strange thread.

Coatings over the paint will help minimize swirls in the clear (as you aren't working directly with the clear at that point), but it's important to remember that *you*, the owner, is who creates these swirls in the first place.

The softer the paint, the easier it is for swirls to form on the surface. Sometimes just using a cheap microfiber is enough to create maaring.

Wax, sealant, opti-coat, or a layer of anything that prevents particulates from moving over the clear coat surface itself will help minimize swirls, but the best thing to do is to remember that whenever you touch a panel it should be well-lubricated to the point that dirt will be encapsulated in whatever detailing product you're using and pulled away from the paint before removal.

no amount of wax, sealant, or hard resin (like opticoat) is going to prevent damage to your paint without proper technique. *with* proper technique, these coatings can help you be a little more reckless in your treatment of the paint without having to worry about damaging the clear. this may mean you will be able to use a lower-quality microfiber, get away with using less detailing spray on a lightly soiled vehicle, etc.

All solid advice, following along. I just got a 2014 pearl white Z, and fortunately, it did not come with the best dealer option around - swirls. I will opticoat it and put a clear bra on it before taking it out though. How is the 370Z paint quality overall? I am coming from a 2013 Wrx, pearl white, and man, you even look at that car, it gets paint chips on the front end, drove me nuts.

Terrible :shakes head:

The clear bra should help with the chips.

Thank u, did the clear bra and opti coated the car, let's see how it goes.

dude I wash my car almost every weekend by hand. I follow every high end car detailers advice you can even find on the internet. dual buckets, expensive *** microfiber, 2 different washmits, bad *** soap, light pressure washer, the best "commonly available" wax and care products available. I even had the car detailed and buffed once "to get rid of the nasty clear coat orange peel from factory" and asked where I could buy all his professional stuff like the sealant and finish cutters. And I can tell you ive got enough experience washing cars to start my own damn detailing business but if you own a car long enough, and you wash it.... EVENTUALLY you will get swirl marks, scratches and other ********. no matter how careful you are, as the years rack up it just happens. My advice is every 5 years or so of careful care, just have it buff/polish/wax detailed professionally for about 600 bucks. Eventually after doing THAT so many times you will need the car recleared if we are talking 10-15 years down the line. My car still looks like it rolled off the assembly line except for the damn road chips you cant avoid, and no more orange peel.

I take real good care of my paint but no matter what I do I still get small swirl marks . I've only had my Z for 7 months (pearl white) and I bought it brand new and after the 3rd month I started seeing small rust spots on my hatch. Now it's all over and and even inside the door jams . Kind of upsetting

Correction, no matter what you have DONE, you've ended up with swirl marks. There are ways to avoid swirl marks, you just ain't doing the correct things. My paint has been swirl free for years and my videos show exactly how I avoid them. It's not rocket science, which is what I preach in those videos.

I would bet money that you sometimes remove dust from your car using a cloth and detail spray, correct?

Absolutely not! Even still, I just spent the better part of a Saturday correcting the paint on my wifes 2013 370z. (thanks Junkman for the instructional vids). I'm super careful washing my cars, and I bought a master blaster to dry them with. I think the marks I saw in the paint were from drying it with a chamois previous to getting the master blaster. I would recommend watching the Junkmans videos on paint care, and repair. He spells things out pretty thoroughly, and if you can follow directions you can obtain VERY satisfactory results. Just for the record I have a Harbor Freight DA polisher and I bought my pads from Detailers Domain, so I didn't tie up a huge amount of cash in equipment.(except for the master blaster)

Actually, I was directing that question to Pearl Z. :tiphat:

I can guarantee you that had something to do with any damage that you were experiencing, although I would not say it was your only issue. The media that you used to wash your car has a lot to do with it also, as well as whether or not you used a foam gun along with your 2-bucket wash. Everything that I do in my 2-bucket wash is EQUALLY important. No part of it can be skipped or side stepped without opening one's paint up to possible damage.

Remember this: If you at one time fixed ALL of the damage in your paint and the damage returns, it is something that YOU are doing that is causing it to return. At that point, you have to look at everything that you are doing when you touch your paint and figure out where the damage is being inflicted. This is what I did for years before coming up with my flawless procedures to protect my paint. I then put that to video and decided to share it with the world. If you alter any part of what I do, then you may or may not open your paint up to possible damage.

Yes I need to use a method. I'll take a look at your video.
No, I have never used a cloth,and detail spray on any of my cars.

people still use chamois, huh? :D that's like using a sponge to wash the car.

i use waffleweave and blot dry. never slide the towel.

Not since I bought the master blaster, and watched the Junkmans videos. Junkman, if you took my previous post as disrespectful it wasn't meant that way. I've learned ALOT from watching your vids and I definitely appreciate the free education. Keep 'em coming!:tup: