You hit the brakes hard. The system flips out and releases the brakes even though your foot is on the floor. It's a scary and hopeless feeling, think hitting ice even though you are on dry pavement.

I gotcha. Same thing as offroading. On later model rides we always pull the fuse on the anti lock brakes. That crap will put you on your roof in two seconds. Thats kinda what I was thinking when I considered started this thread.

so with carbotechs you are more likely to hit ice mode?

With any more aggressive pad you are more likely to hit it, the XP10's and XP12's are particularly aggressive and the ABS system has a hard time modulating.

Track pads suck on the street, I've done it on occasion if I have two events within a week or two of each other but you'll pay with nasty brake dust all over the car (not just the wheels). Track pad dust is even nastier than regular brake pad dust as the pads are typically a semi-metallic compound, once the brake dust gets wet it oxidizes and bonds itself to the paint requiring a very thorough hand wash to remove.

For the street just use the stock pads, they do fine. Pad bite has almost nothing to do with stopping distance.

i just popped the xp8 in, bite is definitely no where close to the 10 and engagement is a lot less harsh, also less dirt and noise

Kinda confussed here. School me if you would please :confused:

Basically all pads have enough bite to lock up the wheel, if you can lock the wheel (at which point ABS kicks in or you manually modulate the brakes) then you have achieved maximum braking potential. Potential braking ability is going to primarily be determined by tire.

The difference between street pads and race pads mostly comes down to temperature handling capacity. Where as a street pad can only take about 500-600F before it starts to fade away (or melt away in case of the stock pads), race pads can potentially handle temperatures as high as 2000F. Race pads are made with different materials, these materials are more abrasive which results in more friction (more bite), more dust, more heat, more noise. Race pad composition varies greatly so there are different pads with different bite levels and temperature handling capacities but they are all going to stop you in exactly the same way, some are just going to require more pedal pressure than others. For track use the decision comes down to "how hot are my brakes getting" and how aggressive bite do I really need? The more aggressive pads are very difficult to modulate, even for the ABS computer, so unless used in conjunction with sticky race slicks they can cause problems.

For the street I would suggest using nothing other than a high quality street pad, race pads have all kinds of issues when they are outside of their ideal operating temperature range. So basically use a street pad for the street and a track pad for the track. The pads are very easy to change on this car, takes more time to remove the wheel than it does to swap the pads.

For a track pad Im extremely happy with the Hawk DT-60 or Performance Friction Pads.

And for the street Ill just run Duralast Golds

Thats what I needed to know. I will be running autocross tires on track days. Thanks for the help.

I went to the track with the stock sport pads. Ill never do it again.

Just FWIW: I've been running XP10 front + XP8 rear for a while now. It's a really solid bite on the track, and it's less prone to ice-mode than the XP8+XP8 setup I was on before (well that and I've learned to reapply quickly at the first hint of ice-mode, too). I've just been leaving them in on the street, but I don't drive that many street miles anyways. They work fine cold, but you do have to be careful of the bite (that you don't surprise someone behind you).

I also duct-tape off my Stillen brake ducts while driving on the street, to help the pads get/stay warmer (helps with maintaining the bedding too). The dust and noise probably isn't for your everyday street driver, but it's manageable. Flat black wheels helps, I never worry about cleaning pad dust off the wheels :)

Yea I like XP10 front 8 rear also.

I ran project Mu club race pads on sunday not bad, I think I will try endless mx72 next.